Tesla finds out about some ownership changes when a new Tesla account is created and the car is moved to the new account. They also had several different SuC programs, some tied to car (transferable), some tied to owner/account for duration of ownership of a particular car (nontransferable), and some for limited months or miles or kWh.
Private party transactions shouldn't lead to available feature changes (beyond features that are tied to a specific Tesla account). But...if a Tesla vehicle is traded in to Tesla, where Tesla becomes the legal owners, all bets are off as to the feature set on the car when Tesla resells it (as compared to the original feature set). In that respect it is like a dealer detuning a tuned-up engine, removing a turbocharger or engine supercharger, or removing other engine or suspension performance parts. On Mon, Feb 10, 2020, 15:27 paul dove via EV <ev@lists.evdl.org> wrote: > My vehicle has free supercharging. They said when I purchased it that > this was not transferable. > I suspect if I sold the car it may take some time for them to realize this > perhaps when it is registered. > At which time they would remove the free supercharging. > I, for one, do not believe Tesla is taking away paid for services. > > On Monday, February 10, 2020, 1:22:54 PM CST, Peri Hartman via EV < > ev@lists.evdl.org> wrote: > > Well, that's probably a legality between the dealer and Tesla. Only if > Tesla did not disclose to the dealer what features would remain could > Tesla be guilty. I'm assuming the dealer knew or was ignorant (probably > the latter). Even if ignorant, that's the dealers fault. > > If it is found that Tesla is changing things that don't accord with an > agreement, then go after them. > > That said, I do think we need to some consumer protection laws so that, > when you buy the car, you aren't signing away future value via some fine > print that you must agree to. > > Peri > > ------ Original Message ------ > From: "paul dove" <dov...@bellsouth.net> > To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <ev@lists.evdl.org>; "Peri > Hartman" <pe...@kotatko.com> > Sent: 10-Feb-20 10:23:14 AM > Subject: Re: [EVDL] Tesla Remotely Removed Autopilot Features from Used > Model S After 'Audit' > > >I would agree with you if it was purchased... However, FSD was never > >purchased. > > > >The person who bought it at auction was a dealership. They sold it to a > >customer telling them it had FSD. But at the time they gave it to the > >customer, FSD had actually been deactivated but they told the customer > >it was just "a glitch", showing them the original Monroney sticker > > > >On Monday, February 10, 2020, 9:48:45 AM CST, Peri Hartman via EV > ><ev@lists.evdl.org> wrote: > > > > > >I agree with David's point of view, mostly. If you buy a car, you > >should > >own it to the extent that it will continue to work in the same manner > >as > >when you bought it, of course allowing for eventual wear and tear. > > > >It becomes difficult to exactly say what "work in the same manner" > >means, but to converge on its meaning would include all essential > >operation of the car as well as any enhancements that were present at > >the time of purchase. It would include software updates as long as the > >owner is paying for the "service" of providing the updates. However, > >the > >updates themselves become part of the owner's property. > > > >It would not include things like map or music streaming services. Or > >real-time server processing of autonomous driving data (I don't know if > >there is such a thing right now). > > > >Other companies are being careful - and I presume Tesla is, too - about > >not disabling original functionality. For example, Microsoft will sell > >you their Office service, which gives you copies of their software on > >your computer but also gives you cloud storage and other email hosting, > >etc. If you stop paying, you lose all the service aspects plus the > >ability to create new documents, but you can still use the software to > >open and read documents. > > > >Ultimately we may need legal clarification of what it means to own, or > >at least indefinitely own the right to use. Similar to the > >right-to-repair issues fomenting right now. > > > >Peri > > > >------ Original Message ------ > >From: "paul dove via EV" <ev@lists.evdl.org> > >To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <ev@lists.evdl.org> > >Cc: "paul dove" <dov...@bellsouth.net>; "EVDL Administrator" > ><evp...@drmm.net> > >Sent: 10-Feb-20 3:59:10 AM > >Subject: Re: [EVDL] Tesla Remotely Removed Autopilot Features from Used > >Model S After 'Audit' > > > > >It’s the exact same thing. His car still drives. Just certain SW > >features don’t work. Cable can shutoff showtime, HBO or whatever else > >you aren’t paying for... I am sure there are comparable examples in the > >auto world I am just not up on features offered with other vehicles > > > > > >Sent from my iPhone > > > > > >> On Feb 10, 2020, at 4:30 AM, EVDL Administrator via EV > ><ev@lists.evdl.org> wrote: > > >> > > >> On 9 Feb 2020 at 18:12, paul dove via EV wrote: > > >> > > >>> Cable TV will shut you off in a heat beat if you arenTMt paying > >for the > > >>> service too. > > >> > > >> I assume you mean HEARTbeat. Cable TV isn't a car. It's not even > >an > > >> antenna. You don't own it. It's strictly a service, to be granted > >or not > > >> at the whim of those providing it. > > >> > > >> You don't really own a Tesla, either. Tesla is, in effect, > >offering EV > > >> transportation as a service, but charging you as if you owned its > >cars. > > >> > > >> It's great that you love "your" Tesla unreservedly. You can keep > >it -- as > > >> long as they allow you to. > > >> > > >> David Roden - Akron, Ohio, USA > > >> EVDL Administrator > > >> > > >> = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = > > >> EVDL Information: http://www.evdl.org/help/ > > >> = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = > > >> Note: mail sent to "evpost" and "etpost" addresses will not > > >> reach me. To send a private message, please obtain my > > >> email address from the webpage http://www.evdl.org/help/ . > > >> = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = > > >> > > >> > > >> _______________________________________________ > > >> UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub > > >> ARCHIVE: http://www.evdl.org/archive/index.html > > >> INFO: http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org > > >> Please discuss EV drag racing at NEDRA > >(http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA) > > >> > > > > > >_______________________________________________ > > >UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub > > >ARCHIVE: http://www.evdl.org/archive/index.html > > >INFO: http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org > > >Please discuss EV drag racing at NEDRA > >(http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA) > > > > > > > > >_______________________________________________ > >UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub > >ARCHIVE: http://www.evdl.org/archive/index.html > >INFO: http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org > >Please discuss EV drag racing at NEDRA > >(http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA) > > > -------------- next part -------------- > An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > URL: < > http://lists.evdl.org/private.cgi/ev-evdl.org/attachments/20200210/798666cc/attachment.html > > > _______________________________________________ > UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub > ARCHIVE: http://www.evdl.org/archive/index.html > INFO: http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org > Please discuss EV drag racing at NEDRA ( > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA) > > > -------------- next part -------------- > An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > URL: < > http://lists.evdl.org/private.cgi/ev-evdl.org/attachments/20200210/efb008c5/attachment.html > > > _______________________________________________ > UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub > ARCHIVE: http://www.evdl.org/archive/index.html > INFO: http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org > Please discuss EV drag racing at NEDRA ( > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA) > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... 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