Hi TOnnie Yes, it was really a pleasure to have lengthy of time. You can really go deep into the topics.
It will be a pleasure to see you in Bilbao Tonnie ! Christine > Le 15 août 2022 à 10:59, info <[email protected]> a écrit : > > Hi Christine, hi all > Thanks for sharing your experiences and insights. I totally agree with > Birgitt about having enough time. Also online, it should not be shorter or > faster, but longer and slower. With people having plenty of time in between > sessions. > All my best, hope to see you in Bilbao > Tonnie > > > > Dr. Tonnie van der Zouwen MCM > www.tonnievanderzouwen.nl > 0650697982 > > > -------- Oorspronkelijk bericht -------- > Van: Birgitt Williams <[email protected]> > Datum: 14-08-2022 22:54 (GMT+01:00) > Aan: > Cc: OS list <[email protected]> > Onderwerp: [OSList] Re: 5 days OST in 3 langages. Practical and general > considerations > > Hi Christine, > Thank you for sharing. There is a lot to be learned from your > experience...things that you currently appreciate that went well, and things > that you are reflecting about in terms of future mulit-language/multi-culture > opportunities. I like that you had so many days...the length of time surely > led to the opportunity for the participants themselves to find their best way > to navigate all that had been prepared for them. > > Hi Lucas, > my only contribution to the online translation topic is the importance of > time...enough time per session for people to figure out how to interact with > translations and with the cultural diversity. And enough time for the OST > event itself. What is enough time, one might ask? Sessions, just as in person > sessions, to be at a minimum of one hour, preferably longer. OST events to be > no less than two four hour time slots, preferably with a night's sleep in > between for further integration via the value of sleep. Ideally, the event > would be several days (on line, I think of a day as four hours). > > Together, we keep on progressing with what we can contribute to the leaders > and organizations we work with. Thankfully we have great colleagues such as > yourselves for ongoing learning and support, > > in genuine contact, > Birgitt > > > > Birgitt Williams > Senior consultant-author-mentor to leaders and consultants > Specialist in organizational and systemic transformation, leadership > development, and the power of nourishing a culture of leadership. > www.dalarinternational.com <http://www.dalarinternational.com/> > > > >> Learn More & Register > >> <http://www.dalarinternational.com/upcoming-workshops/> for any of our > >> upcoming workshops here. > > > PO Box 19373, Raleigh, NC, USA 27613 > Phone: 01-919-522-7750 > Like us on Facebook > <https://dalarinternational.us1.list-manage.com/track/click?u=35ed818c946a88ba7344da05f&id=6677c35b38&e=e7zyhHfiqG> > > Connect on LinkedIn > <https://dalarinternational.us1.list-manage.com/track/click?u=35ed818c946a88ba7344da05f&id=c26173f86b&e=e7zyhHfiqG> > > > > On Sat, Aug 13, 2022 at 8:24 AM Lucas Cioffi <[email protected] > <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: > Thank you for sharing these insights, Christine. I especially like how > participants at your event figured out different ways to make the > conversations happen. > > I don't have any data on what I am about to write, but I believe that in > online events where a translator is necessary, the participants become more > empathetic and there seems to be a deeper human connection between > participants. The result is that having translation actually changes what is > said. I don't know why this is, but I think this is because when people have > to listen to a language that they don't understand, they are reminded that > there are many more things that they do not know compared to things they do > know. I think that when participants are made to feel humble (coming > naturally by the design of the event not by anyone telling them to be humble) > then they have more empathy for others. > > Another reason that this might be true is that if translation is available, > then the organizers were thoughtful in their design and that the meeting has > a lot of resources to succeed. It is possible that participants see that the > meeting has a great organizer or sufficient resources and become more > empathetic or thoughtful or caring -- maybe it is not because they are > humbled. > > All my events in the past few years have been online. Online it is possible > to design an event with translation in at least two ways: > One way is for everyone to hear the event in just their preferred language, > with the translator (or captions created by a person or computer) talking at > the same time as the speaker (this doesn't happen at in-person events unless > participants are listening through headphones). > Another way is for everyone to hear the original speaker and then have to > wait a few seconds for the translation. This slows the conversation down, > but this is the way that builds more empathy, I believe. > It would be a fascinating research topic to see how translation affects the > human connection between people. > > I wish a good day to all, > Lucas Cioffi > > > On Wed, Aug 10, 2022 at 10:50 AM christine koehler > <[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: > > Dear all > > I recently facilitated an OS gathering with translation & interpretation in 3 > langages : French, Spanish and English. I learned a lot and thought it might > be interesting to share it with you. > > Context : > This NGO contacted me a few months ago. They were considering OST for a > special gathering of 80 people for 5 days, had tested it the year before with > 2 small groups, and it worked well, but they still had questions. > > It was a very important gathering for them : they wanted to envision the > future of the way they work, with the people who make it and will take > responsibilities in the future. Their willingness was to enable any people > from any country in the world to be able to contribute and understand > everything. > Historically the NGO was started in France, in the 60’s, and then developed > almost all over the world, especially in South America, Africa and North > America. Today its headquarters are still in France, where they have a > conference room with interpreting booths. Leadership team is also mostly > French is this is something they hoped to change in the future. > The 5 days OST event was due to follow a 4 days gathering were they met in > small groups (same group for the 4 days) to talk about personal experiences > during their work and life. > > > At first I was surprised of their demand of everything in 3 langages. > Reg conversation, I explained them than in OS event, people help each other > and I didn’t see how it would be possible to orient the interpreters as > people would follow law of 2 feet. But they insisted. Same for reports : each > report had to be translated in the 3 langages as soon as it was finished. > > So we organized it as follows : > We had opening circle, with the 3 langages in the opening : Spanish for the > organizing committee, French for the facilitation, English for a Q & A at the > end of the opening. Interpreters were there in the booths, and everyone had > an helmet for understanding the langage(s) he/she didn’t speak. > > Then we build the agenda. With the help of interpreters , usual way of > announcements was supposed to run smoothly. > The only special requirement was to write on top of page so that the > translating team could translate it in the 2 other langages. > As soon as the person had chosen a day, a time and a place and sticked > his/her theme on the wall, the translating team would translate the title > into the 2 other langages. > We tried to used a different color for each langage so that it would be easy > to see the change of langage. > > While opening the market place, we had asked everyone to write one’s name > with a felt pen. Even if they could then change their mind. > > Then the coordinator of the interpreters, a lady form the NGO who knew > everyone well and who could speak the 3 langages, would assign each > interpreter a « room » (we worked a lot in the garden), depending on who was > supposed to go where. > > For the book of proceeding, we worked with Google Drive, in which a folder > had been created with one sub folder for each langage. > One person from the team of translators registered all topics and another > would create the document in the original langage. > The reporter had to find the folder of the langage of the title, open it, > find his/her title and type in one langage only. When completed, he/she would > add the word FINISH at the top of the document . > Then the team would use Google translate to translate into required langages > and put the translation in the required folder. > > > This was how it should have worked. > Of course it did not happen exactly as expected > > For instance at the opening, the mic from the interpreters booths did not > work, although it worked the week before. > So we had a bit of a danse, with only one microphone and the interpreters > standing behind the circle and handing the microphone to one another > depending on who with language was spoken. Finally the tech team discovered a > few hours later that a cable was disconnected.. > > Quickly for the evening and morning news, we took the habit when holding the > microphone to say first our first name then the langage we speak. > However, the group still felt inequality regarding langages, (so much easier > for the French speaking group, who was also the largest). We tried to > encourage speaking in a foreign language when another langage was known. For > instance I spoke in English and my poor English was translated into French. > But we quickly dropped it, as it made the life of the interpreters more > difficult. > > During the day, it was incredibly interesting to see how they worked together > : some groups had conversation in 3 langages, with 3 interpreter each at one > corner of the room or sitting next to a person who needed it. Notes were > sometimes taken on the paperboard in 2 langages by 2 different people. Other > groups could have 2 langages or one only, or begin with one and end with 2 or > 3, welcoming the bees that started to fly after day 2. > What amazed me was the quality of focus and attention of this group. > Incredibly focussed ! I never witnessed side conversations. They were always > caring and paying attention to each other. But this is probably related to > the nature of their work and this is another story. > > > The translation of reports took about one day to find its cruising speed. > Reports had to be read before translated so that organizational jargon was > removed (as Google translate does not understand jargon). Then translation > needed to be read again by the translation team (one lady was working from > South America for the translation into Spanish). > It meant that it took more time than usual to get the reports displayed on > the walls and we had to add deadline each day that the group did not follow. > > Written comments on reports were conditioned to « if you want to add one > comment, pls add a post to note, and take the responsibility to have it in > the 3 langages ». Very discouraging, but it worked : there were 3 comments, > that were added in the book of proceeding as a picture, all in 3 langages. > > The book of proceeding was discussed during evening news, as the group was > eager to inform of their work as quickly as possible, the others who could > not attend. Finally they agreed that the original version would be kept for > them, and a second version, where everyone could make some corrections if > he/she was uneasy with some sentences, would be send a few weeks later. > > The book of proceedings was made available either printed for those who had > no laptop or digital for those who had one. And in each one favorite langage. > That was also amazing. > > It was a very interesting experience for me : > The fact that everyone must have a perfect understanding of everything has a > consequence on facilitation, especially for the last 2 days were we went to > action planning. Some designs were not possible because of the translation. > More structured, it required more coordination with the interpreters team and > more thinking ahead of time with the planning team : they were those who were > the gardians of the langage equality , I noticed that I repeatedly forgot > about it. > And it was also a personal lesson : I was not aware that, speaking 2 dominant > langages, I have a privileged access to communication with always the same > people. I can see how this leads to subtil power domination, even if I don’t > do it on purpose. > And I bet I will quickly forget it, if I am not reminded frequently. > > I will probably reminder for a while something I heard already years ago and > that someone said in the closing circle : « when you tell jokes », as jokes > don’t translate easily or even don’t translate at all in other cultures, « I > don’t get it. It makes me feel separated from you ». In this group, with this > level of care for each other which really I never witnessed before, this > comment had a huge impact of my understanding of what makes a community, how > strong it might be and how fragile it might also be. Something to cherish and > nurture day by day.. > > > Christine Koehler > > > _______________________________________________ > OSList mailing list -- [email protected] <mailto:[email protected]> > To unsubscribe send an email to [email protected] > <mailto:[email protected]> > _______________________________________________ > OSList mailing list -- [email protected] <mailto:[email protected]> > To unsubscribe send an email to [email protected] > <mailto:[email protected]> > _______________________________________________ > OSList mailing list -- [email protected] > To unsubscribe send an email to [email protected]
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