On Wed, Oct 24, 2012 at 7:58 PM, meekerdb <meeke...@verizon.net> wrote:

>  On 10/24/2012 5:41 PM, Jason Resch wrote:
>   That's right.  The meaning, the what is represented, is given by
>>> interaction (including speech) with the environment (including others).  So
>>> only a computer with the ability to interact can seem intelligent and
>>> therefore conscious and only one that interacts intelligently with people
>>> (a robot) can have human-like intelligence that we can infer from behavior.
>> It's not. The data of an mp3 file is interacted with in the same way by a
>> computer whether it is formatted as something we can see or hear, but the
>> computer has no experience of either one. Blindsight also shows that qualia
>> is not an inevitable result of interaction.
>> I agree with what Max said (two years ago!):
>> "Information requires interpretation.  The magic isn't in the bits.
>> The magic is in the interpreter."
> It's 'magic' because you aren't trying to explain it, you're just
> accepting a ghost in the machine to produce meaning.
You are responding to something Rex Allen wrote two years ago, not anything
I wrote.

> Max's post was 23 hours ago.  It is Rex Allen's post from two years ago
> that you and Brent are quoting and responding to.
> Note that I too agree with that bit about the interpreter of information
> being needed for information to have any objective meaning.
> But that's just a semantic "explanation" since "interpreter" and how we
> would know whether or not something is an "interpreter" is left unexplained.

It is a process acting on the information.  With enough analysis, we could
determine what that process is or isn't aware of, and what the information
"means" or (does) to the process.  We could perhaps predict how that
interpreter would have acted differently had it processed different
information, etc.  Thus there can be an objective understanding of the
meaning of that information.  To use Craig's favorite example, we can see
how an ipod interprets an mp3 file, and then the information content of
that mp3 file has a clear meaning in terms of how it leads to certain
vibrational patterns in the air.

> An interpreter is something that acts intelligently on the information.
> And that's what gives it objective (3p observable) meaning.

So are you agreeing with what I said?  It seemed previously that you were


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