On 10 Dec 2013, at 10:40, Alberto G. Corona wrote:
It seems to me that your invocation of platonism is wrong. For Plato
the reality is a shadow of the perfect world of ideas, universals
that we can "remember" by anamnesis.
OK.
But for you reality is a partial dream,
Not at all.
Only physical reality. And it is not "one" dream, it is what result
from an infinity of dreams, by the FPI on arithmetic.
(FPI = first person indeterminacy, *on* the complete UD emulation in
arithmetic).
but coherent or "robust" product of the aleatory Dovetailer Machine,
+ The FPI.
and sometimes we have access to that nonsense by our dreams and
hallucinations.
By comp, and the FPI on all computations going through our comp state
(which exists theoretically, as we work in the comp theory).
So in fact the reality, as the the platonic realm is just the
opposite of the one of the UDA: it is full of structure and perfect,
while the UDA produces every kind of thing possible.
Only computations. Computer science shows this to be a complex
mathematical structure, structured differently from the different
points of view of a machines, which themselves obeys the non trivial
laws of self-reference. It is full of structure.
So at the end while Plato pressuposes order the UDA pressuposes that
there are tree elements that produce everithing that exist, and
those that does not exist.
I assume comp, and then reason. Like Plato we presuppose order
(indeed, brought by arithmetic: we know that the order in arithmetic
is *very* rich, and not completely accessible by *any* effective
theory).
Comp let us just assume no more order than there is in arithmetic, at
he basic ontological (assumed) level..
Al the end there are two theories of everithing: In the beginning
there was order and mind
That is exactly what you get by assuming comp. In the 'beginning' you
have order (the additive/multiplicative structure of the numbers) and
the emerging mind from it (the universal consciousness that you
associate to all universal numbers in arithmetic, by comp, and which
is differentiating through the indexical (self-referential) FPI).
or at the beginning there was some kind of primitive matter and
chaos. Plato theory is in the first case.
Yes. No primitive matter, and the full rich order of the numbers (or
of any Turing universal system).
Yours appears to be in the second.
Not at all. There is no assumed matter, and we assume the order needed
to make sense of computations and Church thesis. You are right that
there is some chaos, but that is part of the (new) world of ideas.
What is your route from chaos to Plato?
The One of the Parmenides (used by Plotinus) = arithmetical truth
(that is full order far beyond what any machine can grasped). Chaos
can be there, like in the prime numbers, but there is also a lot of
music. That chaos is there is what is new in Platonia, but Plato could
not be aware of Gödel.
The Noùs (Plato's universe of ideas) is given by the arithmetical
truth, made partially intelligible by the universal numbers.
The Soul (Plato's soul, Plotinus' universal soul) is given by the
conjunction/intersection of the One, and the Noùs.
Intelligible Matter is given by the conjunction of the Noùs and the
existence of a reality (self-consistency, Dt).
Sensible Matter is given by the conjunction of intelligible matter and
the One.
More on this in the Plotinus' paper. Comp rehabilitates not just
Plato, but Pythagorus (thanks to Church thesis).
Bruno
http://iridia.ulb.ac.be/~marchal/
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