Thi common present moment (CPM for short?) sounds like something introduced
to make the universe seem more intuitively obvious. There is no reason I
know of (theoretical or experimental) to suggest that it really does exist,
and several reasons (theoretical and experimental) to suggest that it
doesn't. Indeed, it sounds rather cosily Newtonian - an "eternal and
absolute" version of time, or to quote the great misnthrope himself,

"Absolute, true and mathematical time, of itself, and from its own nature
flows equably without regard to anything external."

On a separate subject, I'm sorry but "Thank goodness, some sanity and
clarity!" is an attempt at the old, old *ad hominem* strategy - by
implication, everyone who doesn't agree with you isn't sane and clear. I've
been trying to educate certain people around here in correct debating
etiquette, by pointing out that this sort of thing weakens the arguments of
the person saying it, rather than saying *anything whatsoever* against
their opponents' arguments.

...With, I think, some success, judging by the results, which are to get
more honest and more "to the point" debates, despite the odd lapse (some no
doubt by me), rather than wasting time and energy berating those damned
people who keep coming up with those pesky difficult questions. Perhaps you
would be so good as to do the same, regardless of how infuriating people
who don't grasp your vision may be. Take the magnificently cool, rational
and polite Bruno Marchal as a case study, if necessary.

On 28 December 2013 10:35, meekerdb <> wrote:

>  On 12/27/2013 9:55 AM, Edgar L. Owen wrote:
> Brent,
>  Thank goodness, some sanity and clarity!
>  Yes, you are correct and that is pretty much what I'm talking about.
> It's quite easy to understand really. There has to be something happening
> in Andromeda right now simultaneously with what's happening here on earth
> for cosmology to make sense. The fact that clock times cannot be
> instantaneously communicated between the two does not negate that. That
> common, though admittedly non-communicable, 'right now' is the shared
> universal present moment I keep talking about.
> Except that it depends on choosing an arbitrary local reference frame.
> It's not one that extends across the universe because different parts of
> the universe are moving (very rapidly) relative to one-another due to
> expansion.  In GR this implies the absence of a time-like Killing vector
> and it is why there is no way to define globally conserved energy in GR.

You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
"Everything List" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
To post to this group, send email to
Visit this group at
For more options, visit

Reply via email to