Edgar,
On 12 Feb 2014, at 17:57, Edgar L. Owen wrote:
Bruno, and Craig,
Computational reality doesn't need any notion of primes, or 17 is a
prime.
Which confirms that you are using "computational" in a mysterious
idiosyncratic personal sense, and I recall you that you have never
answered my question: what do you mean by "computational", "reality",
and in this case "needs".
In fact I don't see any reason why reality needs any concept even of
17 to compute its current state. If this is true then individual
numbers such as 17 are not necessary for reality to compute the
universe. I suspect what reality does is more 1:1 comparisons.
E.g. when reality makes a computation to conserve and redistribute
particle properties among the outgoing particles of a particle
interaction, it doesn't need to count up 17 of anything, it just has
to know they are all distributed which it can do with simple 1;1
comparisons. It can do that by 1:1 comparisons, not by any notion of
numbers such as 1, 2, or 17 much less any notion of primes.
Ordinal and cardinal number, and all their properties such as odd,
even or prime are thus characteristic of human H-math, not of the
actual R-math of reality that actually computes the current state of
the universe, at least so far as I can see.
In the theory according to which my brain (or more general) is Turing
emulable, there is no such universe.
We don't need, and worst, cannot use, the 1p-plural evidence, for its
existence, but we can find the stable logic of the observable (and
normally all physical *laws*).
In my franc opinion, if you don't mind, you do a similar mistake than
Craig, reifying your own 1p intuition. Yu have not learn how to
communicate in the scientific matter. You seem unable to make clear
your assumption, and you miss the opportunity to test your theory by
comparing it with the one based on the standard definition of
computation.
You do bad philosophy of science if you mistreat the basic definitions
everyone agree on.
Bruno
Edgar
On Wednesday, February 12, 2014 11:36:29 AM UTC-5, Bruno Marchal
wrote:
On 12 Feb 2014, at 13:24, Craig Weinberg wrote:
On Wednesday, February 12, 2014 5:18:21 AM UTC-5, Bruno Marchal
wrote:
On 11 Feb 2014, at 19:58, Craig Weinberg wrote:
Our internal experience is informed directly by opportunities for
quasi-veridical sensory entanglement from within, without, and
beyond our neurology. It is the idea of information and numbers
which is a meta-simulative technology that allows us to project
our control beyond our physical limitations. Computation
accelerates and amplifies existing tendencies of individual and
collective users, both threatening and supporting our survival.
Locally. But to do a scientific (modest and sharbale) theory, we
need to start from 3p agreement, and usually scientists agree with
statements like 17 is prime, but not on sense, quasi-veridical,
entanglement, etc.
I agree that it is an important political consideration, but I
don't think it is a scientific consideration. At one time the
starting point statements that authorities agree with were found in
the book of Genesis.
The analogy does not work, because the statement that 17 is a prime
number is everything but political. But if you want start a party on
the idea that 17 is not prime, you are free to make it political.
You will need propaganda, torture, terror, and many things like that
to keep power, but then why not, we are used to this.
My point was only that if you want to communicate something to
others, you have to adopt a language they understand, and start your
theory from statement on which they can agree "for the sake of the
argument or not" (that's private for the others).
If not, all what you do is already a sort of propaganda. I'm afraid.
Bruno
Craig
Bruno
Craig
Edgar
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