On 10/5/2014 10:27 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote:
On 03 Oct 2014, at 22:30, meekerdb wrote:
Religion is when spiritual people exchange their experience.
Who are the people who are not "spiritual"? Should they be killed?
The people who are not spiritual are those who are not interested in the search.
No problem with them.
Other are just wrong, and not open to change their mind.
It is their problem, as long as they don't impose their idea by violence to me and the
others.
They should not been killed. Frankly I think they should be helped, perhaps
medicated.
It leads to binding and bonding, but the more serious we are in that affair, the more
we can bind with different people, or animals or plants or even relative numbers.
By preventing reason in theology,
I'm all in favor of reason in theology. Just as I'm in favor of reason in astrology
and reason in voodoo. The sooner there's reason in them the sooner they'll go away. No
every crazy idea is worth maintaining, and reason's the best instrument for getting rid
of them.
It means that there is no god, but are you not open to the idea that the physical
universe might exist?
I'm pretty sure the universe exists and that part of it is physical. So, yes I'm open to
the idea that it might all be physical.
Or that the arithmetical propositions, or some vaster set, might be true or false
independently of me?
Sure.
Imagine, we do, one day, the artificial brain. I think if people have not been warned
that this depends of a theory, and needs some act of faith, we will just be lying to
people, to sell a technology.
If you sell them one that's conscious just because it's a universal computer they'll be
right. So you'd better come up with a better standard than "conscious".
By condemning all theologies, you give power to the current one,
Nonsense. That's like saying by condemning witchcraft you give power to astrology. By
condemning homeopathic remedies you give power to magnet therapy. I have a perfectly good
alternative to theology; it's called science.
perverted by politics, and you condemn the greek one, which was a science, and which is
the one which give rise to the science that you like.
There's no "a science"; there's just one "science". There's not a science of ghosts or a
science of water dowsing or a science of astrology - those are just theories and within
science they've lost out to other theories. Science is just common sense writ large and
pursue rigorously.
What is the problem calling God the reason why you are here, and then trying to solve
the problem,
The problem is that "God" is a word in the english language that does not mean "why you
are here". It means a superhuman powerful father figure who will answer prayers and
punish anyone who disobeys His commands. Paul Tillich tried redefining "God" to mean that
which is most important to you. Turned out "God" was a lot of different things and the
definition didn't actually make anything definite.
without prejudice of what god can be or not, but trying to remain consistent, and
starting from facts and theories (like computationalism for example).
By mocking the use of reason in theology, you are de facto an ally of
aristotle's theology.
I said I was all for using reason in theology. I look forward to it, provided reason
includes considering empirical facts. Promoting theology you an are ally of Catholicism,
Hinduism, Islam, and ISIL.
There are tuns of good papers on neoplatonist theology, I am sure you might change your
mind on the whole subject by studying them. But you can also just accept the comp formal
definition of the theology of the machine M, which is the set of truth about her (as
opposed to what she might believe or justify).
How can the set of true propositions be defined? How can it known whether a given
statement is true? I doubt that all true propositions about a "machine" constitute a set.
If you really don't believe in the abrahamic god, why is it a problem to use the term
god in the greek sense (the transcendent truth we need hope for to not get mad, that is
to get sense and semantic)?
It wouldn't be a problem at all if I were speaking ancient greek to ancient greek
philosophers.
Brent
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