On Sat, Nov 29, 2014 at 3:30 AM, Kim Jones <kimjo...@ozemail.com.au> wrote:
> If nature came up with feeling first and high level intelligence only >> much much later, I don't see why the opposite would be true for our >> computers. >> > > >> So this is the the meat in your sandwich. It is so revealing. It > requires a "self" or a "person" or a "subject" or an "ego" or a "me" or an > "I" or a consciousness to allow for qualia to come through. No, the meat in my sandwich is that If nature came up with feeling first and high level intelligence only much much later, I don't see why the opposite would be true for our computers. > > Without this entity - whatever it is - there is no experience of > anything possible. So what? We might look on such a situation as undesirable but as far as Evolution is concerned that would be perfectly OK. And yet that is NOT the situation Evolution has produced, and I explained exactly why. You did not. > Qualia create experience. Experience is 1st person only. Well good for Qualia, but however important Qualis may be to us it's irrelevant to Evolution . > You cannot experience my experience and I cannot experience yours. True, and Evolution can't experience or detect either of our consciousnesses and yet it produced them both. How can that be? There is only one way, consciousness MUST be a byproduct of something else that Evolution CAN detect, something like intelligent behavior. > How the hell are we ever going to get use out of AIs whose experience we > cannot plug into and monitor, Johnno? > The same way we get use out of this conversational experience even though neither of us can experience the others consciousness, Kimmie. > > experience just is and is probably purposeless. The word "purposeless" is purposeless unless there is a referent. Purposeless for who? Maybe the universe finds me to be purposeless but I don't care any more than the universe would care if I found it to be purposeless; we both just ignore the others opinion of and continue to go about our business. John K Clark -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
