On 08 Dec 2014, at 19:29, meekerdb wrote:
On 12/8/2014 2:59 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote:
On 08 Dec 2014, at 04:55, John Clark wrote:
On Fri, Dec 5, 2014 at 6:16 AM, Samiya Illias <[email protected]
> wrote:
> As a person who takes the Quran literally, I'm not at all
surprised as it is stated that the ancients had been given much
more, and we haven't been given a tenth of what they had.
Think what you're saying! At one time the human race was
knowledgeable enough to construct the Antikythera Mechanism, but
200 years after it was made Jesus was born and started a major
world religion, and 630 years after Jesus Mohamed was born and
started another major world religious; and by the time Mohamed
died we'd lost over 90% of our smarts. Actually there is some
truth in what you say, certainly during Mohamed's lifetime nobody
on the planet knew how to make something like the Antikythera
Mechanism, a device that was made nearly a thousand years before.
I said it before I'll sat it again, religion makes people stupid.
Not religion, but the imposition of a religion to others, whatever
that religion is. But that is made possible by the separation of
religion from science, which is a way to accept the lack of rigor
and the use of the argument-per-authority in the field of theology.
Strong atheists want to keep up that separation, which perpetuates
the institutionalized religious nonsense.
You have never refute my argument that (strong) atheism is de facto
ally with the Churches against reason. In fact they too try to
impose their religious beliefs on other, with the aggravating
factor that they pretend not to be religious.
Atheists have no "religious beliefs" except that there is no
personal god who judges and answers prayers...
OK. That is one religious beliefs, often accompanied with thought like
"death is the absolute end for me, etc."
Many have another one: they believe in a primitive physical universe.
They make it into a god (which is defined by the reason why we are
conscious).
that's the literal meaning of a-theist. It is a word that is only
useful because the default assumption is that everyone is a theist.
We don't need the word "a-leprechaunist" or "a-voodooist" or "a-
unicornist" because the default assumption is that people don't
believe those fairy tales. Atheists try to "impose their beliefs"
the same way you do, by rational argument and empirical observation.
Those I met use only mockery and ad hominem stances. They never
discussed, nor even accept meeting or mail discussion. John Clark is
respectable for answering mail, but he illustrates then the point: he
uses only mockery, ad hominem remarks, assertion of being superior,
etc. But he insists not reading Plato, Plotinus, or any rationalist
mystic people.
Twenty six states in the U.S. have provisions in their constitutions
that prohibit atheists from holding political office. No atheist
has ever voted for or proposed a law to prohibit theists from
holding office.
They should have done so, in case those theists are members of sects
or religious institutions confusing temporal and atemporal concerns.
Perhaps.
I can believe in anticlericalism, but the atheists, in many countries
acts more clerically than "believers", with hypocrisy added to the
plate.
Of course I mean "strong atheists", not the agnostic one. In fact I
mean only the people against the return of reason in theology. I have
met many of them. Some belongs to lodge with quite catholic-like
ritual, and they behaves in a quite sectarian way. In the anglo-saxon
world, free mason can be protestant or catholic, in Europa, most
lodges contains string atheists, and they act more clerically than the
priests in the Church.
But once you believe in a reality other than your consciousness, you
are a believer. Dismissing the science theology is a way to impose
religious belief on others, be it a God, a Matter, Money, or anything.
You lost your right to doubt.
Bruno
Brent
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