On Sat, Jan 17, 2015 at 5:32 PM, meekerdb <[email protected]> wrote:
> On 1/17/2015 2:35 PM, Jason Resch wrote: > > > > On Sat, Jan 17, 2015 at 2:12 PM, meekerdb <[email protected]> wrote: > >> On 1/17/2015 2:02 AM, Jason Resch wrote: >> >> >> >> On Fri, Jan 16, 2015 at 7:46 PM, meekerdb <[email protected]> wrote: >> >>> On 1/15/2015 8:31 PM, Kim Jones wrote: >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> On 16 Jan 2015, at 5:18 am, meekerdb <[email protected]> wrote: >>> >>> On 1/15/2015 3:04 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: >>> >>> It is the reason why I stopped, a long time ago, to qualify myself as an >>> atheist. I realized that atheists believe to much in the christian God, >>> paradoxically enough. >>> >>> >>> By your logic one cannot disbelieve in anything because to do so you >>> have to conceive of what it is your are failing to believe (otherwise you >>> don't know what you're talking about); >>> >>> >>> >>> Well, yes. Of course you have to be able to conceive of what you are >>> going to make a choice to believe in or not! Implying that you "have the >>> right" to disbelieve in something you cannot conceive of is the height of >>> sophistry. You are merely testifying to the limitation of your own, or of >>> human imagination but that is precisely the terrain we are treading here: >>> the interface of human ignorance with what is really real. >>> >>> Of course the human imagination cannot conceive of God the way God is. >>> This is because WE ARE ALL THE EYES AND EARS OF GOD. The eye cannot see >>> itself. The hammer cannot hit itself. It can only infer it's true nature >>> using the imagination and HOPE that the description adopted is exact. It >>> never is. We cannot know what or who we are. It's a pretty miserable state >>> of affairs, particularly if you are a hard-nosed scientist, I gather. >>> >>> >>> Hard-nosed scientists are inured to not knowing things. It's mystics >>> who insist on making up an answer because they are uncomfortable with >>> uncertainty. >>> >> >> "Not knowing" >> >> a- (not) >> -gnostic (know) >> >> If scientists are inured to not knowing, why not consider yourself >> agnostic? >> >> >> "Agnostic" is a broad term. You can be agnostic about almost any >> question. People mean so many different things by "God" to say one is >> agnostic about the existence of God is virtually meaningless. >> > > I agree, but I also think the same applies to atheism, (which god > exactly is it you believe does not exist?) > > >> But to say you are an atheist is fairly specific, one who doesn't >> believe the theist god exists. >> > > I think you are perhaps in the minority to take definition of the term, > though I respect it for its enhanced specificity. > > >> So, if asked, I could say I'm agnostic, but what would I be agnostic >> about. I wouldn't be agnostic about the god of Abraham (which is how it's >> likely to be understood in the U.S.). What would you mean if you said you >> were an agnostic? >> > > By saying I was agnostic, I would mean that I don't proclaim to have > reached any final truths concerning the nature of reality. > > > So you're assuming that the object of unqualified "agnostic" is "the final > nature of reality". > Yes. You don't mean you're agnostic about everything, such as Zeus or the teapot > orbiting Jupiter. > But the existence (or non existence) of those things depends on the assumed theory regarding the nature of reality. > But the person to whom you say "I'm AN agnostic." is likely to assume the > object about which you are agnostic is the God of Abraham. > Why? > Which is fine if you want to dissemble. > Why do you take the Abrahamic God to be the canonical definition? There are 7 billion people on this Earth and most of them are not Christian, Jewish or Muslim. Jason -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to [email protected]. To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
