> On 8 Jun 2018, at 20:14, John Clark <[email protected]> wrote: > > On Fri, Jun 8, 2018 at 6:49 AM, Bruno Marchal <[email protected] > <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: > > >> Here? Where? You said there were many improvements in theology between > 500BC and 500AD and I asked for examples, and for the second time you were > unable to provide a single one. > > > I provided them; already twice in this thread. You are simply lying here. > I gave the references. > > You provided a list of people, you did not provide one single example of an > improvement in theology made between 500BC and 500AD . Not one. > > >> Be specific! What improvement in theology are you referring to? > > > This who led to the first of mathematics, physics, up to mathematical > logic. > > I don't care who led what, and neither physics nor mathematical logic is > religion. I asked 3 times but you did not provide one single example of an > improvement in theology between 500BC and 500AD . Not one.
The improvement is from believing in giant Turtles to both modern physics and mathematics, and eventually that the ultimate reality is a immaterial sort of person. It is slow and hard to explain, especially to someone having show so much bad faith, that I will not try to develop. But the improvement has stopped in Occident with the assassination of Hypatia (who was teaching math and Pltonius theology in Alexandria) and more so with Justinian closure or Plato Academy. Theology has continued to progress in the middle-east, up to Averroes. Unfortunately, in the Middle-east, Al Ghazali will win the date against Averroes, and science, including theology, will decline in the Middle-east since then. But Averoes ideas will survive in part and come “back” in Occident, leading to the renaissance. The big difference between Averoes and Al Ghazali is that Averoes explains that in theology, (which really just meant for him: fundamental science) the interpretation of texts and experiences has to be subdued to reason, where Al Ghazali defends, like the Muslim Brotherhood today, the idea that reason must be subdued to texts, which is a total drawback from the rational approach of the greek Theologian (again from Pythagorus to Damascus). That subduction of reason to texts is what allowed the political use of religion, which is a technic of control of people by “special interest”. You just cannot separate theology of science, without making them both inexact and inhuman. If the christians did not fall in that trap themselves, we would have avoided 1500 years of dark ages, and we might not ever been so naïve to believe that there is a primary physical universe, given that there has never been any evidences for it. > > > I gave the references, just read them. > > So you don't know of an example of a improvement in theology made between > 500BC and 500AD but for some unspecified reason you believe there may be such > a example somewhere in some book and you want me to try to find one. > No, I want you to read them, and understand the improvement by yourself, but I make no illusion, given that you cannot understand step 3, which is far more simple than any of those old text. I have learned greek to be able to compare different translation. Also, you seem to be not aware that your use of “primary matter”, that you call simply “matter” is not just theological, but is invalid from a scientist (in theology) point of view. Fundamental science and religion have always been the same thing, except when religion becomes a tools in (bad) politics. You just help those misuse of theology by special interest by refusing the coming back of reason and experiences in the field. You are a *de facto* ally of obscurantism. Bruno > Bruno, is that really the best you can do? If it was reversed and I had said > something like that in our debates would it have convince you that I was > right? If so I could have saved a lot of time by just writing “some book > shows that you are wrong” > > over and over. > > John K Clark > > > > > > > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Everything List" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to [email protected] > <mailto:[email protected]>. > To post to this group, send email to [email protected] > <mailto:[email protected]>. > Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/everything-list > <https://groups.google.com/group/everything-list>. > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout > <https://groups.google.com/d/optout>. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to [email protected]. To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
