> On 20 Jul 2019, at 00:04, 'Brent Meeker' via Everything List > <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > On 7/19/2019 4:49 AM, Telmo Menezes wrote: >> I share their perplexity. The idea of immaterialism is natural (and arises >> thousands of years ago), because the only thing that we cannot doubt (as >> Descartes pointed out) -- our consciousness -- is immaterial. There is not >> scientific instrument that can detect consciousness. > > That's not really true. Of course doctors assess patients as conscious, > unconscious, in coma, or brain dead every day. The myth that consciousness > is a mystery is part hubris
Then mechanism cures that “hubris”. It could be hubris at Descartes’ time, where many thought that consciousness was a human thing, and animals have no souls. But today, many attribute consciousness to many animals, and mechanism makes the point that consciousness begins with Turing universality, and self-consciousness with Gödel-Löbianity. > (we are too special to be understood) and part an exaggerated demand for > understanding. With mechanism, consciousness is simple, as it is explained by the distinction between all modes of the self that the machine can be aware of. The problem which remains is only in deriving the “stable persistent and sharable dreams” from the web of dreams in arithmetic (which cannot be avoided if you accept to link consciousness to the person related to the relevant computations). > There's no scientific instrument that can detect the wave function of an > electron either. But with the electron we're happy to have an effective > theory that tells us when the detector will click or not. Mystery mongering > about consciousness makes us demand something more that mere measurement and > prediction, something that doesn't exist for any theory. Assuming a physical reality, but in that case mechanism becomes inconsistent, as I have shown. Consciousness is simple, because computer science somehow predicts it, easily from incompleteness + Theaetetus. It is matter the real hard problem in the mind-body problem, but we are not aware of this, a bit like fishes are not well placed to talk on water. Bruno > > Brent > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Everything List" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to [email protected]. > To view this discussion on the web visit > https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/1ae59181-0197-8be6-a320-418771e9d823%40verizon.net. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to [email protected]. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/D46FF432-3016-44EF-97FE-2C1B903079E6%40ulb.ac.be.
