On Wed, Mar 15, 2023, 8:45 AM Jason Resch <[email protected]> wrote:
> > > On Wed, Mar 15, 2023, 7:59 AM <[email protected]> wrote: > >> I am a not a neurobiologist, old son. I could try to see if there are any >> papers out on grey goo becoming self-aware and self-reflecting? My >> Definition! >> > > Anything with a "self" is conscious. > Anything with "awareness" is conscious. > > Therefore your definition of "self awareness", by restricting > consciousness to things that are only aware of oneself but not other things > in the environment, you may only be capturing some, but not all classes of > consciousness entities. > > Likewise by defining consciousness as "self reflection", you may overly > restrict consciousness only to those selves which happen to reflect upon > that self, and perhaps wrongly deny consciousness to selves who do not self > reflect. > > It is possible that reflection (at least reflection on some level) is > necessary to consciousness. But I have not seen a strong argument for it > yet. I do think the capacities for self-awareness and self-reflection exist > in humans, but do we do it all the time? > > Are we self reflecting and self aware of ourself in every moment of our > consciousness? What about raw sensory experiences when we live in the > moment, such as when catching a wave or riding a rollercoaster? > > Are fruit flies self-reflecting and self-aware? Are they consciousness of > the presence of a banana on the counter? These questions keep me up at > night. > > > > >> If you have a paper on how consciousness arises from intel, Nvida, and >> AMD chips please supply the link. It's chips and salsa to me. >> > > I think focusing on hardware is a red herring. Consciousness is a high > level phenomenon and I believe it exists in high level abstractions of > information processing and computation. Seeking the magic of consciousness > in the neurochemicals or silicon chips is in my view, as misguided as > seeking to find it in the quarks and electrons. > > > > > >> If you claim something just spoke from a D-Wave superchilled box and it >> asked how you were doing, I'd consider that a true possibility. Photonics? >> Ok lets roll with it. >> > > Trace the physical causes behind someone uttering the words "I am > conscious" back through the signals in the nerves of their vocal cords into > the deepest recesses of their brain. There you will find consciousness as > the processes that stand behind the person thinking and reasoning and > concluding, and then deciding to utter the words "I am conscious". > > I think you can do the same for any silicon or quantum computer, in > principle. Consciousness, presumably, is what causes us to talk about > consciousness. It's therefore something that exists in the causal chain of > physics, and something amenable to investigation. > > Jason > > > >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: John Clark <[email protected]> >> To: [email protected] >> Cc: [email protected] <[email protected]> >> Sent: Mon, Mar 13, 2023 2:08 pm >> Subject: Re: ChatGPT's rebuttal to Chomsky >> >> On Mon, Mar 13, 2023 at 12:55 AM spudboy100 via Everything List < >> [email protected]> wrote: >> >> *> I still need to know how it became conscious when just using chips and >> data* >> >> >> I'll tell you just as soon as you tell me how 3 pounds of gray goo >> inside of a vat made of bone that is sitting on your shoulders manages to >> be conscious. >> >> John K Clark See what's on my new list at Extropolis >> <https://groups.google.com/g/extropolis> >> vmb >> >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "Everything List" group. >> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an >> email to [email protected]. >> To view this discussion on the web visit >> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/CAJPayv04H7Ry%3DctkkhfRUj_w5gid5u6txq-XYfsmbG8DkUXJ2Q%40mail.gmail.com >> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/CAJPayv04H7Ry%3DctkkhfRUj_w5gid5u6txq-XYfsmbG8DkUXJ2Q%40mail.gmail.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> >> . >> > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to [email protected]. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/CA%2BBCJUgOh3J%2BWkRowuy3BTR48_C9RGVrhxLsVtg-k7UxzKsXnQ%40mail.gmail.com.
