On Sun, 2003-11-09 at 15:49, Praedor Atrebates wrote: > Fine. Do they all have root password available so they can do updates, > reconfigure, build and install? These are things that are essentially > handfed to windoze users. You click on an install button and app X is > installed. Done. On linux this requires root. Simple enough if you are > used to this but it is just another layer of complexity if you are a doze > user. > > Sure, this admin is everyone thing is one of the primary weaknesses of doze > wrt viruses, worms, and hackers, but it is easier to work with. > > My father can install a CD in his doze computer and click "Install" without > problem. There would be problems if I had to walk him through setting up a > root password (and remember it!), then a user password (remember it!). OK > dad, setup your wireless connection. On doze this is trivial.
depends on your box. On this one it won't work with doze. Does with Linux. I've gone both ways over the last 6 months. > On linux it > is a frickin pain in the ass (I do it, after a modicum of hair pulling but > then I know what I'm doing). You download your tarball, untar it, read the > readme and install files. HOPEFULLY you will simply need to do a ./configure > && make && make install (as root) and the driver will be ready. Now you just > have to either mess with ugly commands via iwpriv or ifconfig. Depends on > your device. And short of the compile in doze it's buy a card. Find out that the chipset and the driver on the disk don't match. Download a new driver find out it's incompatible with your laptop. Drive to Fry's exchange and start all over. Took 3 trips to Fry's for a business partner of mine to get a working wireless in his new Dell. (and 4 calls to Dell) On my laptop it flat won't work with doze. On linux I've had 6 different cards work the same way. Plug them in. They work. (mostly ones I borrowed from friends.) > > OK, now setup spam filtering. Hah! Joe Blow can't handle it. WE can because > we have generally been doing this for some time AND we have the time and > inclination to learn all of this. Add in procmail (and the need to setup > postfix or similar. Whew! Complexity beyond anything people mess with in > doze). Yes, linux is great and powerful. I love it. But I would never ever > be able to get my father, mother, wife to deal with all this. And ya know, > you just can't always be there to deal with other people's computers all the > time. My father doesn't live next door, he lives next state over. > Which is why it should be on the MTA not on the box. > Unless Joe/Jane Blow user has an expert somewhere, they are not equipped to > deal with linux. It's just that simple. And again, how do you explain to > them that they'll just have to give up the cool games if they go linux? They > LOVE the games afterall. OK, just reboot to winders. Well, why not just > STAY in winders so you don't have to deal with the rebooting all the time? > My Mom is on Unix (70 next may) my sister and my 3 year old... just to give you the other side of the coin. (My wife won't try it. or rather doesn't know she's using it. *grin*) > I merely think that for MOST people at home, linux is not there yet. For > people at work or at schools where there are admins to deal with all the > complexity of configuring and handling software install, it is perfectly > fine, but for most at home? Nope. Not yet. The number one problem I've found with Linux is that the people advocating it (And lord knows I'm as guilty as anyone) shows people way to much. Second advantage it's already installed. This is an advantage that cannot be matched with Linux. Since rarely if ever does it come both pre-installed and working right. (Note both conditions.) I just spent 3 days working with a guy setting up filters in outlook. Thank god I use evolution, since they are so similar. 2 days on the phone, the third I said the heck with it drove to his house and we did it face to face. His XP box had been setup right. both a user and an admin (not running all the time as root like most boxes.) As for spam filtering. Can't find one that works right in windows. Just flat not fine grained enough or easy enough for someone like my wife to use/install. Some things are admin tasks and need to remain that way. No matter what OS. > > On Sunday 09 November 2003 11:48 am, Lyvim Xaphir wrote: > > On Sun, 2003-11-09 at 11:02, Ronald J. Hall wrote: > > > On Sunday 09 November 2003 09:24 am, Praedor Atrebates wrote: > > > > Well, I gotta say that Redhat does have a point. I do think that linux > > > > is not yet ready for the everyday desktop user except for Lindows - for > > > > a relatively small subpopulation. > > > > > > Hmm, I disagree. My 10 and 12 year old (not to mention my wife) use > > > Mandrake here with very few problems. > > > > > > Sure, my wife uses it almost exclusively for e-mail and web-browsing, but > > > thats what the Windoze majority does anyways, right? > > > > > > and the boys use it mostly for games...again, following the norm. > > > > > > Most Windows users run to a local Windog guru when they have problems > > > anyways, and thats what my crowd here does - run to me. So whats the > > > diff? :-) > > > > I've noticed the exact same thing, DL. In fact a young person I know > > recently told me that he could install and run Mandrake without trouble, > > yet couldn't seem to get winblowz to operate as easily, and deferred to > > a local shop for assistance in getting his winblowz to work correctly. > > > > LX
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