--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Michael Jackson <mjackson74@...> wrote: > > Experiences like these are part of the reason I no longer believe "enlightenment" tied up in a neat package the way Marshy described it even exists -
I think the old rishis in the ancient times were having all these self created opium dreams (brought on by inhaling too deeply of the forest floor molds) and made a complex system of ideas all about the experiences. Having read some of the Vedic literature such as the Yoga Vashishta, I really couldn't disagree more. I mean it's a cute little slight you make, but I suspect that over time, what once inspired you, (or me) becomes more distant and more dim. I don't know what would happen if I read some of the books now. But having immersed myself in the Upanishads, the Gita, and various other tracts in my earlier days, I believe they contain profound truths, and insights into higher levels of awareness, (enlightenment), as well as a greater understanding of practical matters regarding breath, bodily functions, and sexual energy. Simply the whole science of kundalini, (if one wants to call it a science) is something completely ignored by western science. As is the field of prana. Maybe these tracts will have nothing to offer in this regard. I suspect that will not be the case. > I have read and heard too many accounts of people like Mark Landau and Robin who have what sound like truly fabulous experiences for months or years and then start just being regular people again, same with the Rama-man. I think that maybe we can all experience a plethora of states of awareness, alternating in flavor and intensity but who knows what the bottom line on all of it is? > > > > > ________________________________ > From: turquoiseb no_re...@yahoogroups.com > To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com > Sent: Saturday, March 30, 2013 11:07 AM > Subject: [FairfieldLife] Career As Path (was Re: Majorca Spain to turq) > > > Â > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Share Long sharelong60@ wrote: > > > > Do you think Lenz was unenlightened and became unenlightened? > > Or what? > > I believe that he definitely experienced what many over > the centuries have described as enlightened states of > mind. Like Curtis, I do not call these states of mind > "higher states of consciousness," feeling that "altered > states" is both more accurate and less likely to be > misunderstood and misrepresented. No one has *ever* > been able to prove that these states are "higher" than > any other, only that they are different than what the > mainstream experiences. > > Meditating with Rama in the early years was an exper- > ience unlike any other I have had in this lifetime. > The silence emanating from the dude was so profound > that if you were sitting in the same room with him, > there was no question of wanting to still your mind > or stop thoughts. You couldn't *have* a thought. > > That said, I personally believe that two things fucked > up the inner silence/seeming enlightenment he emanated > in the early days of his teaching. The first was hubris: > starting to believe his own PR, and allowing his already- > sizable ego to grow out of control. The second was > Valium. Towards the end he almost never meditated, and > my belief is that the reason why is that he knew that > those of us who had meditated with him years ago would > notice the difference, and that he could no longer > access -- much less radiate -- those deep levels of > silent mind. > > > Is France still Catholic enough that you all are having > > a 4 day weekend? > > I have a three-day weekend, as does most of Europe. I'm > back in the Netherlands, and they're off Monday as well. > France still has a lot of Catholics, but on the whole > they're a remarkably secular society, as is Spain and > the Netherlands. That does *not* keep them from taking > advantage of every religious holiday that comes around > as a day off of work. :-) > > > ________________________________ > > From: turquoiseb no_re...@yahoogroups.com > > To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com > > Sent: Wednesday, March 27, 2013 7:44 AM > > Subject: [FairfieldLife] Career As Path (was Re: Majorca Spain to turq) > > > > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Share Long <sharelong60@> wrote: > > > > > > Why do you think he [Rama - Fred Lenz] did himself in? > > > > He *claimed* to some who were close to him that he > > was dying of some undiagnosed and undiagnosable > > illness, and that he just didn't want to waste away > > in some ghastly hospital. I, however, got ahold of > > the coroner's autopsy report, and there was no trace > > of serious disease. > > > > My theory of The Big Why is very simple, and meshes > > well with what people who were close to him said: > > drugs. He'd gotten himself addicted to Valium, first > > prescribed after an injury, but he liked the effects > > of it so much that it had begun to affect both his > > behavior and his judgment. On the Valium label it > > says in big, bold letters, "If you have been taking > > this drug for some time, do NOT try to stop suddenly. > > If you do, you risk side effects including depression, > > psychotic symptoms, and suicide." So what did Mr. > > I-can-handle-it do? He tried to quit taking Valium > > cold turkey. Three days later he was dead, a suicide. > > > > > Were you still involved when that happened? > > > > No, I had left a couple of years earlier, when the > > focus of what it was like to study with him shifted > > away from meditation and things that most (including > > me) considered "spiritual," and began to focus on > > mainly business and career success. Besides, it had > > stopped being fun, so I split. Never regretted it. > > >
