yeah, sorry about this as well. I wrote something without thinking too much here...
my point was neither to cause offense nor to lead to argument over the matter of values. instead, this can be taken as "an interpretation" or as "a possibility". another way it can be taken is that certain things have traditionally been held to be good, and others bad. which are which and under which conditions has been well documented historically, although people at times have disagreed over many of the details (and as to which authorities have higher precedence in these matters, ...). granted, at this point in time there is no real analogue of ISO or ECMA over moral matters, so people are allowed their own opinions and interpretations. historically at least, there has generally been concensus over most such matters, and I guess if someone really wants they can ague about what are the majority positions / ... at the present time. but, yeah, arguing here will not accomplish anything, and this was not my intention here. ----- Original Message ----- From: chris mills To: Fundamentals of New Computing Sent: Thursday, July 08, 2010 11:20 AM Subject: Re: [fonc] goals Agreed. Apologies folks, it was a knee jerk reaction to a statement I found offensive. On 8 July 2010 19:17, Alex Abate Biral <[email protected]> wrote: People, I really think this isn't the right mailing list for this kind of discussion. On Thu, Jul 8, 2010 at 3:11 PM, chris mills <[email protected]> wrote: On 8 July 2010 17:40, BGB <[email protected]> wrote: however, morals, ... would seem to be degraded in industrialized nations (note the widespread prevelance of promiscuity, gays, gangs and violence, ...), so this may be a cost associated with industrialization (although there is not any obvious reason why one would lead to the other). this may also be a cost of urbanization though, I don't know. Whoa there, going off topic a bit I know, but I take offence to the suggestion that homosexuality is evidence of moral degradation. Indeed as an unashamed european lefty I would argue that discrimination against gays, minorities, etc is actually greater evidence of moral degradation and this is thankfully becoming less common in the industrialised world. And I would suggest you have a word with a Rwandan, Zimbabwean or Afghan (to name but a few) about whether gangs and violence are worst in the industrialised nations or non-industrialised. Or if you wish to argue against urbanisation I am pretty sure that my own country (england) had some pretty nasty violence before large scale urbanisation - civil wars, violence of landowners against those living on their land, persecution of catholics/protestants (depending on whether catholics or protestants were in charge at the time), burning folks at the stake for unsubstantiated accusations of witch craft, etc. A change in the prevailing moral code does not imply a degradation.
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