This was Chu and Ho's earlier paper they published last year. I was somewhat dissatisfied with both that paper, and Louie's rebuttal, however Chu and Ho's paper that just recently came out is a stronger paper.
Cheers On Sat, Dec 29, 2007 at 08:43:31AM -0800, Gus Koehler wrote: > A Living System Must Have Noncomputable Models > A. H. Louie > > Abstract: Chu and Ho's recent paper in Artificial Life is riddled with > errors. In particular, they > use a wrong definition of Robert Rosen's mechanism. This renders their > "critical assessment" of > Rosen's central proof null and void. > http://www.panmere.com/rosen/Louie_noncomp_pre_rev.pdf > > Gus Koehler, Ph.D. > President and Principal > Time Structures, Inc. > 1545 University Ave. > Sacramento, CA 95825 > 916-564-8683, Fax: 916-564-7895 > Cell: 916-716-1740 > www.timestructures.com > Save A Tree - please don't print this unless you really need to. > > > -----Original Message----- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf > Of Joost Rekveld > Sent: Saturday, December 29, 2007 5:34 AM > To: The Friday Morning Applied Complexity Coffee Group > Subject: Re: [FRIAM] Robert Rosen > > Hi, > > apparently these articles have given rise to rebuttals, see http:// > www.panmere.com/?cat=18 for a survey of this discussion. > > I read 'Life Itself' a while ago, found it extremely interesting but not an > easy read either. Later I read some of the essays from 'Essays on Life > Itself", which helped. The biggest problem with Rosen's writing was for me > that it is very concise; for a layman (like me) it would have been good to > have a bit more flesh around his central argument, in the form of historical > references and examples. > > Later I discovered the writings of Howard Pattee (an essay in the first > Artificial Life proceedings) and Peter Cariani (his thesis from > 1989 <http://homepage.mac.com/cariani/CarianiWebsite/Cariani89.pdf> > and a later article for example <http://homepage.mac.com/cariani/ > CarianiWebsite/Cariani98.pdf>. > I found both their writings more digestible. > > hope this helps, > > Joost. > > On Dec 29, 2007, at 5:03 AM, Russell Standish wrote: > > > By all means have a discussion. Rosen is not an easy read, nor easy to > > talk about even. I have some grumbles with Rosen, which I mention in > > my paper "On Complexity and Emergence", but these are fairly muted. > > There've been some interesting articles recently in Artificial Life by > > Chu & Ho that appear to disprove Rosen's central theorem. I suspect > > their rather more rigourous approach crystalises some of my grumbles, > > but I haven't found the time yet to try out the analysis more formally > > myself. > > > > Cheers > > > > On Fri, Dec 28, 2007 at 08:41:43PM -0700, Nicholas Thompson wrote: > >> All, > >> > >> On the recommendation of somebody on this list, I started reading > >> Rosen's Life Itself. It does indeed, as the recommender suggested, > >> seem to relate to my peculiar way of looking at such things as > >> adaptation, motivation, etc. The book is both intriguing and > >> somewhat over my head. Pied Piperish in that regard. So I am > >> wondering if there are folks on the list who wold like to talk about > >> it. By the way, does the fact that I am attracted to Rosen make me a > >> category theorist? I am told that that is somewhat to the left of > >> being an astrologer. > >> > >> Nick > >> > > > ------------------------------------------- > > Joost Rekveld > ----------- http://www.lumen.nu/rekveld > > ------------------------------------------- > > "This alone I ask you, O reader, that when you peruse the > account of these marvels that you do not set up for yourself > as a standard human intellectual pride, but rather the great > size and vastness of earth and sky; and, comparing with > that Infinity these slender shadows in which miserably and > anxiously we are enveloped, you will easily know that I have > related nothing which is beyond belief." > (Girolamo Cardano) > > ------------------------------------------- > > > > > > > ============================================================ > FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv > Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College > lectures, archives, unsubscribe, maps at http://www.friam.org > > > ============================================================ > FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv > Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College > lectures, archives, unsubscribe, maps at http://www.friam.org -- ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- A/Prof Russell Standish Phone 0425 253119 (mobile) Mathematics UNSW SYDNEY 2052 [EMAIL PROTECTED] Australia http://www.hpcoders.com.au ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ============================================================ FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College lectures, archives, unsubscribe, maps at http://www.friam.org
