Respectfully, that's quite different. -----Original Message----- From: Tomas L. Byrnes [mailto:[email protected]] Sent: Friday, December 19, 2008 9:07 PM To: Alex Eckelberry; Gadi Evron; Rob, grandpa of Ryan, Trevor, Devon & Hannah Cc: [email protected]; [email protected] Subject: RE: [funsec] Apparently Milgram is still right
I think it depends on what you classify as torture. Apparently, this now includes what the parents of most teenagers endure nightly. http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2008/jun/19/usa.guantanamo >-----Original Message----- >From: Alex Eckelberry [mailto:[email protected]] >Sent: Friday, December 19, 2008 5:58 PM >To: Tomas L. Byrnes; Gadi Evron; Rob, grandpa of Ryan, Trevor, Devon & >Hannah >Cc: [email protected]; [email protected] >Subject: RE: [funsec] Apparently Milgram is still right > >True, and there is a point of ethics vs. morals. But in the end, >there's a line that, IMHO, shouldn't be crossed. > >Besides, at a purely ethical level, torture is a low-quality >interrogation technique. It's overrated in its effectiveness, and >creates boomerang effects which don't benefit an overall cause. > >Nevertheless, even arguing torture at a logical level is difficult for >me. It's just reprehensible, not because of some pacificist ideology: >Because beating the living shit out of someone for information brings us >to the level of animals, and that's what we've been trying to evolve >from for a very long time. > >Something Matthew Alexander spoke and wrote of recently: > >http://snipurl.com/8wosv > > >Alex > >-----Original Message----- >From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] >On Behalf Of Tomas L. Byrnes >Sent: Friday, December 19, 2008 8:19 PM >To: Gadi Evron; Rob, grandpa of Ryan, Trevor, Devon & Hannah >Cc: [email protected]; [email protected] >Subject: Re: [funsec] Apparently Milgram is still right > >I guess it depends on who you think you owe an ethical duty to, doesn't >it. > > > >>-----Original Message----- >>From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] >>On Behalf Of Gadi Evron >>Sent: Friday, December 19, 2008 4:11 PM >>To: Rob, grandpa of Ryan, Trevor, Devon & Hannah >>Cc: [email protected]; [email protected] >>Subject: Re: [funsec] Apparently Milgram is still right >> >>On Fri, 19 Dec 2008, Rob, grandpa of Ryan, Trevor, Devon & Hannah >wrote: >>> People are still willing to torture people, when told to do so by an >>authority. >>> >>> http://news.bbc.co.uk/go/em/-/2/hi/health/7791278.stm >>> >>> This may explain some recent happenings, but it is still disturbing, >>nonetheless. >>> We in infosec, and members of society as a whole, have to push harder >>on the >>> ethics front. >> >>What does this have to do with ethics? >>It's a trick question, think before answering. :) >> >> >>> >>> ====================== (quote inserted randomly by Pegasus Mailer) >>> [email protected] [email protected] >[email protected] >>> This day I call heaven and earth as witnesses against you that I have > >>> set before you life and death, blessings and curses. Now >>> choose life.... - Deuteronomy 30:19 >>> victoria.tc.ca/techrev/rms.htm >>blogs.securiteam.com/index.php/archives/author/p1/ >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Fun and Misc security discussion for OT posts. >>> https://linuxbox.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/funsec >>> Note: funsec is a public and open mailing list. >>> >>_______________________________________________ >>Fun and Misc security discussion for OT posts. >>https://linuxbox.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/funsec >>Note: funsec is a public and open mailing list. > >_______________________________________________ >Fun and Misc security discussion for OT posts. >https://linuxbox.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/funsec >Note: funsec is a public and open mailing list. _______________________________________________ Fun and Misc security discussion for OT posts. https://linuxbox.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/funsec Note: funsec is a public and open mailing list.
