Lawry, Natasha,
Are you saying the Arabs didn't have the courage or the forethought to plan such a thing? It does sound stupid to place the American Nuclear gun sites on Mecca and Medina. If they didn't do it, why take the chance that America would mount an immediate nuclear response on Mecca as they had targeted the Soviet Union? That would speak against whosama taking credit unless they were just macho psychopaths Maybe Whosama was trying to ruin his father who rebuilt Mecca? Such layered reality suggests almost anything and such a reality means that almost anything said has another possibility. The simplest is probably the answer. Take for example the symmetrical descent of the two towers. No one has taken that architectural tube structure down before. It's unique structure could just be the way that falls when all of the building supports are in the sheath of the building. There was no core to break up the symmetricallity. The special sheath strength was a new factor for demolition. Who knows? As for the locals doing it? To what purpose would you destroy the brain of the world Financial System? It's more likely that the little guys in the Windows on the World who went to Mosque in Queens just got spooked by Thomas Barnett and his breakfast discussions between the war college, the pentagon and the huge trading partner Cantor Fitzgerald, Inc. who were planning the future of the Middle East including using the American War Machine. This is not news. Barnett was giving lectures on it on C-Span at the Navy War College and writing about it in, I believe it was the Atlantic Magazine. I asked Barnett about the kitchen help at the Windows and he basically admitted that he hadn't thought about it. So much for security! I saw a new restaurant opened by the chefs from the Windows after the fall of the Towers. The ones who hadn't been on duty on 9/11. It included Islamic chefs. That Mosque in Queens tried once and their Mullah is still in jail for it. What makes you think that they would go quietly into the night if they heard a powerful planner/instigator like Barnett was planning on behalf of the government with the corporation that had more money going through it in one year than the entire U.S. economy? (Barnett's claim on C-Span) Alternate scenarios is what I do for a living. It's called opera. REH From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of de Bivort Lawrence Sent: Friday, August 03, 2012 7:25 AM To: RE-DESIGNING WORK, INCOME DISTRIBUTION, EDUCATION Subject: Re: [Futurework] It's always been Eastasia You are right, Natalia, there is no evidence that Usama bin Laden carried out or planned the September 11 attacks. There is considerable circumstantial evidence that he did not. There is evidence that after the attacks, Usama bin Laden and key al-Qaida leaders, already accused of carrying out the attacks, decided in a number of ways to embrace and exploit the accusation to advance their general purposes. There was tremendous and understandable pressure on the US intelligence agencies to identify the culprit. Usama bin Laden and al-Qaida were obvious suspects, had already engineered comparable attacks in the past, and made for plausible culprits. Some of the people who pointed the finger at al-Qaida privately felt that if it was not responsible for September 11, it deserved on the basis of its previous attacks to be nailed for September 11. Others felt that it would be useful to correctly identify the real culprits, and yet others who agreed that it was not al-Qaida felt that it would not be useful -- for any of several reason -- to identify the real culprits. I offer no speculation as to who did it, nor have I studied the myriad conspiracy theories that do so. I guess that the myth will control the public history of the matter. Cheers, Lawry On Aug 2, 2012, at 2:58 PM, D & N wrote: Mike, As mentioned at the end of my reply to Keith, I was drawing attention to the Al Qaeda/US associations of convenience and inconvenience, which is conspiratorial in nature. I have never believed, nor have I read nor seen anything one could call incontrovertible evidence of Bin Laden's guilt. I agree with your point below, and would add that I find it particularly annoying that all media sources these days make the same presumption based on popular belief derived from propaganda. The acceptance of this single fabrication gave licence to all other lies around 9/11 and the two oil wars that followed. Natalia On 01/08/2012 10:24 PM, Mike Spencer wrote: Natalia wrote: Conspiracy theory debunkers-- cover your eyes. Maybe I haven't been paying attention. After all, there's been gigabytes of stuff written and said about 9/11 in the last decade, much of it obviously totally crackpot in character. I haven't read most of it and I haven't watched dozens (or hundreds) of hours of TV "news" and punditry. But remind me: just when was it conclusively established the bin Laden was responsible for the attack? Immediately after the attack, he was quoted in the press as saying [1]: I was not involved in the September 11 attacks in the United States nor did I have knowledge of the attacks. There exists a government within a government within the United States. The United States should try to trace the perpetrators of these attacks within itself; to the people who want to make the present century a century of conflict between Islam and Christianity. That secret government must be asked as to who carried out the attacks. ... The American system is totally in control of the Jews, whose first priority is Israel, not the United States. -- Osama bin Laden (Reported by BBC) I have already said that I am not involved in the 11 September attacks in the United States. As a Muslim, I try my best to avoid telling a lie. I had no knowledge of these attacks, nor do I consider the killing of innocent women, children and other humans as an appreciable act. Islam strictly forbids causing harm to innocent women, children and other people. Such a practice is forbidden even in the course of a battle. -- Osama bin Laden (Sep 2001) AFAIK, he never contradicted that position. The usual rule is that the perpetrators of political violence, whether terror, assassination or whatever, seek credit for the victory over the hated foe. So: was there ever anything conclusive that fingered ObL? Or is "ObL done it" something that Everybody Knows [2] and I should just feel, you know, humiliated and inadequate because I don't know it also? - Mike [1] I don't have exact references to cite. You can probably google key phrases and find them. [2] A case of epistemological engineering? _______________________________________________ Futurework mailing list [email protected] https://lists.uwaterloo.ca/mailman/listinfo/futurework
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