Re: [Futurework] Why men succeed at work

[Ray Evans Harrell]

The late Shaman Priest Don Jose Matsua and his two apprentices  Prem Das and Joan Halifax.   There is also an extant yarn painting that shows of what I speak.  It has the husband sitting in the rafters as the wife gives birth.  She is holding the string attached to his testicles and he does not look happy.    It could have been a joke for the Northerner since they are a humurous people but I always accepted it as a point being made about the place of women and the putting the man in his place.  As a Cherokee our women were equal and to this day own the property.   If a man does not take care of her properly she can simply put his shoes outside the door and they are divorced.   As for men's stories about women, I work with very tough opera singers who work through their pregnancy and it is not something that the male singers would generally do.   The first modern businesswomen in the West were these tough liberated women who stood their ground, demanded their pay and often didn't marry because it would stop their work.   Perhaps the women you have known are different.   I would suggest that even the toughest men only experience the endurance of women in the act of war.   I believe that you can also find texts in support of that from one of the more tough peoples I have known.  The Aztec.   I've done four day no food or water fasts but the Azteca had a nine day fast with no food or water.    From the age of five their children slept on stone floors with a simple cotton blanket and a breech cloth.   We have a ceremony every morning to go to the water no matter what the weather.   But that is short.   These children began in a mile high atmosphere on a cold stone floor with nothing but a reed mat and a thin cotton blanket.   I'm working on grants at the moment.   Thanks for the break.   Ray Evans Harrell     ----- Original Message ----- From: Salvador R. S�nchez Guti�rrez To: Ray Evans Harrell ; [EMAIL PROTECTED] ; Keith Hudson Sent: Sunday, June 29, 2003 12:06 PM Subject: Re: [Futurework] Why men succeed at work Sorry, but I don�t believe this story about the huicholes. Does it come from a good reliable source? By the way, I�m not totally convinced about this kind of comparisons about men and women. If we, men, had the task of giving birth we surely would have been equipped by nature with all the resources needed for carrying a baby for nine months and then giving birth. Besides, women also complains, complaining is not a monopoly of men. Everybody complains in this interesting days, we live in the era of complaining. It's nice and politically correct make comparisons in which men are the bad of the story, but it�s not always right.   Salvador Sanchez     From: Ray Evans Harrell To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ; Keith Hudson Sent: Saturday, June 28, 2003 9:17 PM Subject: Re: [Futurework] Why men succeed at work This is a trip.   When a woman competes in a man's area he complains but when she doesn't follow his work rules he complains.   I wonder how he would do at carrying a baby for nine months and then giving birth.   The Huichol's decided to find out when the men were bragging too much about the hunting while the women tended the fields.  They tied a leather thong around the man's genitals and as the wife gave birth she was given the thongs to pull along with the labor pains.   I wonder if she was a socialist?   REH