do you honestly think I'd hear a pit warning sound and be like "ok, I didn't hear that. no I absolutely just didn't hear that very clear and distinct pit noise because pits aren't challenging to me"... we can't turn off our senses like a light switch and turn them back on when it's convenient for us to do so. please stop trying to patronize me. everyone else is getting their point across without doing so.


----- Original Message ----- From: "Hayden Presley" <hdpres...@hotmail.com>
To: "'Gamers Discussion list'" <gamers@audyssey.org>
Sent: Wednesday, April 06, 2011 9:40 PM
Subject: Re: [Audyssey] anyone got anny suggestions for the nextversion ofbattlezone?


Hi,
If pits are already not challenging for you thyen why does it matter?

Best Regards,
Hayden


-----Original Message-----
From: gamers-boun...@audyssey.org [mailto:gamers-boun...@audyssey.org] On
Behalf Of Yohandy
Sent: Wednesday, April 06, 2011 8:38 PM
To: Gamers Discussion list
Subject: Re: [Audyssey] anyone got anny suggestions for the next version
ofbattlezone?

it's hard not to use a cue when it's playing right in your ear lol. we end
up taking it for granted eventually whether we wish to or not. we get lazy
and we think, hey it's there, so why not use it? MOTA's a great example.
once upon a time, there were no boundary sounds, so we didn't use them. now
there are, so we run at a pit and jump as soon as we hear the sound. why
would I walk all slow and take my time calculating distances when I know
there's gonna be this sound that'll alert me?




----- Original Message ----- From: "Clement Chou" <chou.clem...@gmail.com>
To: "Gamers Discussion list" <gamers@audyssey.org>
Sent: Wednesday, April 06, 2011 9:26 PM
Subject: Re: [Audyssey] anyone got anny suggestions for the next version
ofbattlezone?


Personally, best option in my opinion is just to treat it as extra
ambiance if you don't want to use it as a cue. I know in my experiences
whenever I've walked near a pit in real life it's never just been an
abrupt stop... there's either loose dirt or an edge, something of the
sort... and adapting isn't really the problem here. The problem is more
the ability to judge the distances and ranges in the first place.

At 06:21 PM 06/04/2011, you wrote:
Clement,
I definitely understand where you're coming from. I guess when it comes to

gaming, everyone has a whole ton of differing opinions. personally when it

comes to thinking a mile a minute, I have absolutely no problem with that.

I can have a ton of blades, pits, and fireballs all near me at once and
still react almost immediately to the threat. however I take your point
that not everyone might be able to do that. Perhaps we can because we
mostly play mainstream games and adapting is the norm for us? who knows.
I'll definitely try and remember that next time though. however I think
that if such a feature was added to a game, there should be a way to take
it off for those not wishing to use it.




----- Original Message ----- From: "Clement Chou" <chou.clem...@gmail.com>
To: "Gamers Discussion list" <gamers@audyssey.org>
Sent: Wednesday, April 06, 2011 9:01 PM
Subject: Re: [Audyssey] anyone got anny suggestions for the next version
ofbattlezone?


Before I go any further, let me just state that any comments I make on
this subject are purely for the sake of discussion... you're my friend
and I have no desire to antagonize you by going against you. lol.
The problem with judging distances, again, is that wind sound. You can't
concretely judge how far it is from you by just listening for it.. unless

you pinpoint the position of that sound in your headphones or speakers
and memorize where it is. And in frantic fights, if you have enemies
coming at you and your mind is bent on taking care of them first, you
really don't have the option to stop and judge that sound while you're
being pummelled.

The problem with judging distances like they do in mainstream games is
that, a sighted person can look at that pit and see how wide it is,
whether they need a running jump or not. In audio games, you don't have
that. Unless the dev programs the look command to tell you how wide the
pit is, you have to guess. So some people would prefer warning sounds so
they at least have a source to go on. I personally don't care either way.

I played mainstream games for long periods of time before I even knew of
audio games, so it doesn't really matter to me. I can cope with either.

Target sounds for when enemies are in range is fair to me. Because why
stand there mashing space until you hit something? Especially in this
game, where the sound that is used to sound the attack is also the sound
that signifies the hit. There is no difference between the two... unlike
in mainstream games where you generally have a sound for the attack and a

second sound for the hit, so if you miss an attack, that hit effect won't

play. And fireballs are a different case from pits as you can stand still

and wait for it to come to you... and there really is no appropriate time

to duck. Soon as you hear a fireball, if you wanted you could just kill
nearby enemies and stay crouched until the fireball passes by. Sounds for

blades are not necessary as that would also remove challenge from the
game since the whole point is to time your run past them. That's where
sighted people and blind gamers have the same challenge. They have to
observe the paterns at which the blades shoot out and retract. We have to

do the same... with sound.

You asked how far do we take the dumbing down approach? This is exactly
what so many hardcore fighting game fans had about Marvel VS. Capcom 3
and Street Fighter IV when they first came out... as a diehard fighting
fan myself, I knew where the arguments came from. Less buttons in the
case of MVC 3 as compared to MVC 2, supers and ultras in SF and the
removal of the perry system from SF 3, x-factor for MVC... I could go on
and on. This was all done to make the game more accessible for new
players while still retaining depth in the games. A lot of people said
that that kind of adjustment was dumbing the game down for the scrubs out

there. Maybe they're right. Maybe they're wrong. I personally think
they're wrong... because there's still a lot of deep fighting to be had
in both games. That kind of attitude is exactly why so many people never
get into fighting games... because the pros are so adverse to
accessibility and the like. When you look at it.. the two situations are
remarkably similar.


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