HI Raul, Please see my comments below. Best,
Erik Burggraaf Join me Wednesday, May 26th at CNIB Tech Aids fair in Toronto. I'll be at the assistive computing booth from 2 to 4 in the afternoon and circulating for the rest of the day. http://www.erik-burggraaf.com 888-255-5194 On 2010-05-13, at 11:52 PM, Raul A. Gallegos wrote: > "Bryan, I'm curious, where you live, have the maps changed that much from > 2007 to 2010 that it makes your current SenseNav unusable like you say?" > Speaking for toronto, I can assure you that my 2008 map has several instances > of streets that go the wrong way. It also has innumerable out of date POI's. > Because I'm using mobile geo, I can call a POI directly from within mgeo on > my mobile phone, which is convenient, but a lot of the time I get "this > number is not in service" or some such and that's not really very convenient > at all. When a street on the map is going the wrong way or intersections > aren't reported properly, that gets me lost and frustrated, and late for work > even if I start out early which is even more frustrating and puts my schedule > back for the rest of the day. I'm dealing directly with clients in their > home and I just can't afford that, especially considering what I paid for a > navigation aid, which really and truly is nowhere near what sensenav users > have paid. > "Regarding the SyncBraille, if it's out of warranty, with any hardware > product, a standard $45 analysis charge is always charged. So we are not > singling you out here with it." Well, every company is different. Humanware didn't charge me to look, but they did charge me a full hour at $125 per to put three new router caps on and clean and update the unit. Hardware service is expensive no matter what. You know, I'm not really a huge fan of freedom scientific, but they do offer an option to buy an extended warrantee, which as far as I know, humanware, optelec and GWMicro do not. Of course, you will almost certainly take advantage of your sma for your fs hardware if you buy it. The point is, value added services. GWMicro is king of the value added service on the software side, with not one but two license to order programs for screen readers, premium sma's, free and timely upgrades and more. No one is doing this on the hardware side, and the first company to jump on this is going to start making sales really quickly. For example, if some one offered a three year warrantee out of the box, that would be an industry first and completely blow away the competition. Here in Ontario, you only get funding for new equipment every 5 years, and nothing's built to last that long anymore. A company that offers some sort of financing for really high priced hardware, same thing. The industry in general, certainly not so much GWMicro in particular, has a perception that users don't really care as long as they ask for a note taker or braille display and get one. Some one else, government, rehab, insurance, is paying for it anyway, so why should we care? unfortunately I've found that perception to be largely dead on, but that doesn't necessarily make it right and good. The point is, it's not unreasonable to charge, but eventually a company will probably jump up miles ahead in the value added service department and leave the competition behind. > "Regarding the firmware, I have personally been pushing for new updates for a > long time. Whether you believe me or not is up to you, but I think that > anyone who knows me will believe that I feel strongly that the Sense > notetakers are very good and they need to > stay up-to-date." I don't really think it's such a matter of believing. All of us are involved and have a stake in the sense one way or the other. Most of the people on this list own one and use it to enrich their lives in various ways. I'm not fortunate enough to own one, but I do get to use them regularly. I get to sell them to happy customers and train happy clients on using the features, and that's no small thing. We all understand that you don't get a say in such decisions, and no one is attacking here. But at the same time, you are our voice, and when we post here, we expect that our commentary is getting back through you to the people who do have the decision making power. Upgrades are one of those value added services I was talking about earlier. Now, in the case of office 2007 support, it's great, and it had to happen. But my pocket pc phones have supported it since 2007, my freeware programs on the mac, open office and text edit have supported office 2007 since I switched to the mac in february of 2008. Not just word, but excel as well that I have tested. And yet the braille sense is just coming out with it now, I'm not even sure if duxbury does support it yet. Not as of may 2009, although it should now. K1000 v11 didn't. I haven't got the new one to test it yet, but the change log makes no mention of new file formats supported. I'd be shocked and horrified to find out it still doesn't, but at that, it was only released this year. So it's not just the sense products. Why are all these really high priced technologies so slow to adopt, when my commercial and freeware stuff has been able to do this for years? What about office 2010? If the new file format builds on the 2007 format and the two are compatible then our gleaming new upgrade will cary us forward. But if they re-invent the wheel again, we'll be back where we started in four months when office 2010 hits the market. Of course it will take a while to move in and that will extend the grace period, but still. This is hardly a great advertisement for the sense, especially when on the software side window-eyes has been able to ring the Microsoft gong pretty well with direct object modelling for better focus and more accurate representation of documents in word, excel, and powerpoint for the office 2003 and 2007 suites. As a lowly trainer, barely a step up from an end user, I'm sure that I'm only seeing one leg of the elephant. I do not really believe that all these technology companies are holding me back on purpose because they want me to have antiquated crap, Or because they feel they can make more money holding out on customers. I don't really see a conspiracy here, but I don't see the rational either and so I chew my fingers off in frustration. > > Many thanks. > > On 5/13/2010 11:05 AM, Bryan Duarte wrote: >> I am with you on this issue sir. I bought a voice sense, sync Braille, >> and the sense nave right when they were released. now I have had a voice >> sense with no promised up grades, a sync Braille that no longer works >> and to get it fixed they want to charge me 45 dollars a half hour to >> diagnose the problem then parts and labor is separate, and a sense nav >> that has maps from who knows how long ago with no information on when >> and how much a new upgrade will cost. don’t get me wrong I love my voice >> sense and the sync Braille when it worked was great. the sense nav was >> awesome when the map was accurate but now that times have moved on and >> the technology has not things are looking down on the distributors and >> manufacturers. to me making new products when the old products you >> currently have are not being maintained is a little backwards I think. I >> use to use my voice sense a lot more when it was an all in one device >> that was up to date on all systems. now that I have a firm ware that >> could not even pretend to bat an eye at other note takers and a sense >> nav that was awesome three years ago when it was somewhat accurate as to >> what was around me, but now I have over 8 thousand dollars invested into >> a refreshable Braille display that acts as a Braille paper weight, and a >> GPS receiver that takes up space in my travel back pack just waiting to >> come out and play some day in the future. >> >> >> >> Bryan Duarte Blind Ambitions >> >> >> >> *From:* erik burggraaf [mailto:[email protected]] >> *Sent:* Thursday, May 13, 2010 6:36 AM >> *To:* [email protected] >> *Subject:* Re: [GWN] Tip1 for the new Sense notetaker firmware >> >> >> >> >> >> Again, it's the licensing, not the software that is at issue. >> >> What I'm reading is that braille note and mobile geo can physically >> share map data on properly licensed and compatible devices, but >> braille sense can't, which is a severe limitation. >> >> Don't forget that all these devices are built on the same >> development kit, no matter what brand name you put on it. That >> doesn't make them all equal, but it at least holds out the option to >> have them compatible. An option which, based on what people are >> saying here, braille note and mobile geo offer, but sensenav does not. >> >> Then we have the issue of the licensing for current maps. For >> example, I've just found out that 2010 maps are only licensed to >> mobile geo 2. That of course is so that I and others like me will >> have to by msp4 and mgeo2 to get a current map, which we have the >> option to do. But if the 2010 map were licensed to sensenav, then >> one way or the other sensenav could use it. Taking care of this >> licensing shouldn't require a firmware upgrade, but if it did, then >> it could be done by a patch without requiring an entire firmware, >> since they did that very thing for the braille note. If a fee had >> to be charged for upgrading maps, well, so be it. Everyone has a >> right to make money at what they do. Users who aren't greatly >> effected by using old map data can buy a case of beer on the >> weekend, where-as hard core travellers who need consistent accuracy >> could go without for a weekend or two and get the upgrade. In fact, >> I'm reasonably sure that any one who forked out 6 grand for a bsp, >> and $1600 for sensenav are not going to quibble at a $60-$80 upgrade >> fee for the map data for their high priced kit. Even sighted gps >> users incur that cost, although most commercial gps are farely >> disposable and so the cost is usually built into a whole new unit >> and they don't realize they're paying for it. >> >> This doesn't seem like rocket science to me. Old map, increasingly >> inaccurate, potential time, money and safety concern. Answer, give >> the customer an option to pay for a new map when an update becomes >> available. Then if you want to trundle around unfamiliar areas with >> a three year old map on your $8000 gps, well you go on and giver, >> but the rest of us can be getting on with the best possible >> information, especially when you're like me and you need it for work >> or school. >> >> best, >> >> Erik Burggraaf >> Join me Wednesday, May 26th at CNIB Tech Aids fair in Toronto. I'll >> be at the assistive computing booth from 2 to 4 in the afternoon and >> circulating for the rest of the day. >> http://www.erik-burggraaf.com >> 888-255-5194 >> >> On 2010-05-12, at 5:18 AM, Keith Bucher wrote: >> >> >> Erik, >> >> >> >> Sense Nav is a HIMS or Gw Micro product not a Sendero product. >> >> Sendero licenses it to GW Micro and HIMS. If you use Sense Nav, >> >> as of right now, you are stuck with the 2007 maps. The later maps >> >> are just for the Braillenote products from Humanware. >> >> >> >> >> >> Keith >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> If you wish to unsubscribe from this list, visit: >> >> >> >> http://www.gwmicro.com/listserv >> >> >> If you wish to unsubscribe from this list, visit: >> >> http://www.gwmicro.com/listserv > > > -- > Raul A. Gallegos > GW Micro Technical Support And Product Specialist > Voice 260-489-3671, Fax 260-489-2608 > Web http://www.gwmicro.com > > If you wish to unsubscribe from this list, visit: > > http://www.gwmicro.com/listserv > If you wish to unsubscribe from this list, visit: http://www.gwmicro.com/listserv
