Kernel != Distribution Anyway I'm done with this. Have fun 2009/1/6 Blood Letter <[email protected]>
> > When talking about server binaries, you've got your OS and your CPU. > Any system configuration issues are understandable. (For example, if > Norton broke the server.) Seems to me the x86 instruction set + > listed-as-supported linux/windows kernel versions provide only a dozen or so > combinations. > If you didn't test on said hardware+os, don't list it as supported. > > But the fact is we know the issues with the server code, and the client > code, are not due to configuration differences, as they are experienced by > all, and are repeatable. > > > > Date: Tue, 6 Jan 2009 17:12:15 +0000 > > From: [email protected] > > To: [email protected] > > Subject: Re: [hlds] Valve It's Time To Listen And Answer! > > > > If you had ANY remote idea of how many hardware/os configurations there > are > > out there that could cause problems, you would be a little more lenient. > > While some of valve's releases have been a little too buggy for anyones > > liking, i'm sure that they test things as much as they can before > release, > > why would they want to let them selves be known for this sort of thing. > > If valve took a day to fix a release for L4D for example, you sound > exactly > > like the type of person who would spend time, opening up his email > client, > > and writing another rant about how much valve fails for not releasing on > > time. > > > > 2009/1/6 SakeFox <[email protected]> > > > > > it's been basically treated as the norm that it's russian roulette with > > > any update or game release. they keep pushing server files without > > > testing them and we suffer for it. i can't count the number of times > > > after a tf2 update that servers would work because of the server > update. > > > Look at the game launches TF2 linux binaries didn't work for hours and > > > L4D windows binaries didn't work for hours. Is the next game just going > > > to have broken binaries for both servers? Is it really that hard to > test > > > something before you make it live. This happens all the time and > getting > > > more frequent. > > > > > > Karl Weckstrom wrote: > > > > Now THAT is what I consider "Well said". > > > > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > > From: [email protected] [mailto: > > > [email protected]] On Behalf Of Blood Letter > > > > Sent: Tuesday, January 06, 2009 11:50 AM > > > > To: [email protected] > > > > Subject: Re: [hlds] Valve It's Time To Listen And Answer! > > > > > > > > > > > > If Valve completely ignores server operators who provide free > servers, > > > without which their games would be useless, they suck. > > > > > > > > If Valve lets long standing bugs, exploits, and security issues go > > > unattended while focusing only on the latest content update + free > weekend, > > > they clearly prioritize sales over customers. > > > > > > > > I don't know about Valve's office, but if something goes wrong with a > > > system at my office, even on Christmas day, we respond to it, and come > into > > > the office if necessary. If there are fires wreaking havoc with the > power > > > grid and people are being evacuated from their homes, we coordinate to > make > > > sure our servers are backed up, the backups are offsite, and the > servers are > > > safe. > > > > > > > > If someone at Valve wants a break, they can take vacation days. Do > they > > > only have 3 guys, and each only does 1 thing? I hope not. Any company > > > worth it's salt knows you need redundancy in your mind share. > > > > > > > > Valve IS ignoring this list, by not replying. They get torn apart > > > because they never respond to important issues, they're always late, > and > > > they never, EVER, provide clear and complete answers, let alone any > > > semblance of documentation. > > > > > > > > Even if I were a child, I would still be a paying customer. If > you're > > > saying Valve gets a pass because gaming is not a priority in life, then > you > > > don't understand a single thing about having a job. If your job is to > make > > > games, you do that. If your job is to deliver mail, you do that. > Working > > > in a particular job sector does not give you the right to slack off. > > > > > > > > If Valve fixes everything and provides complete and correct > > > documentation, then they get support and sales. Going from an F to an > A > > > doesn't change the fact that you still had an F. > > > > > > > > No one is treating Valve like shit. We are simply demanding we get > some > > > support, some documentation, and some communication. We get none of > those > > > things. Being a customer DOES give you the right to expect a certain > level > > > of quality and service from the business you are patronizing. > > > > > > > > If Valve's priorities continue to diverge from what so many of us > expect, > > > that's fine. They'll just lose our money and our support. Let's be > clear > > > here - server admins are supporting Valve, not the other way around. > I'm > > > sorry I can't apply for a job at Valve, I already have a job of my own. > I > > > can't be programming for everyone in the world, can I? Regardless, I > > > wouldn't want to work in an office where a complete lack of customer > support > > > gets a passing grade. > > > > > > > > Valve's lack of support and communication is indefensible to anyone > with > > > even a remote knowledge of programming and software development. > > > > > > > > > > > >> Date: Tue, 6 Jan 2009 11:12:41 -0500 > > > >> From: [email protected] > > > >> To: [email protected] > > > >> Subject: Re: [hlds] Valve It's Time To Listen And Answer! > > > >> > > > >> If Valve doesn't do everything we say, they suck. If Valve doesn't > fix > > > >> everything now, they suck. If Valve doesn't kiss our asses every > second > > > of > > > >> every day, they suck. They don't care, they won't fix this, they > refuse > > > to > > > >> fix that. All they want is our money. > > > >> > > > >> You all sound like a broken record. And worse than that, you have > no > > > lives > > > >> outside of this thing we have here. Did anyone stop to think that > since > > > >> they all busted their asses for who knows how long getting Left 4 > Dead > > > out > > > >> the door, while providing updates to TF2 the whole time, that > > > maybe...just > > > >> maybe, they'd want to take a break for a little while during the > > > holidays? > > > >> You know...so they could spend time with their families. > > > >> > > > >> Honestly, since release of TOB, there have been a relentless amount > of > > > >> updates to their products. In the time that has passed from TOB > until > > > now, > > > >> the only people being neglected were probably most of the families > of > > > Valve > > > >> employees. Does anyone feel they deserve a little break? > > > >> > > > >> They're ignoring us? Really? You think so? Does anyone here > subscribe > > > to > > > >> HLCoders? A little civility goes a long way. In my opinion, Valve > > > isn't > > > >> ignoring this list, they just don't want to reply. I swear, this > list = > > > >> SPUF sometimes. Any two words they say are held against them > forever. > > > >> > > > >> I know that a lot of kids subscribe to this list, so it would be > > > difficult > > > >> for a lot of you to understand, but there is such a thing as > priorities > > > in > > > >> life. Gaming is not as high on that list once you have a family to > take > > > >> care of and a boss to answer to. And you are not the boss of anyone > at > > > >> Valve. > > > >> > > > >> Valve knows about the problems, obviously. You all keep saying the > same > > > >> things over and over. Give them a break. Just because you didn't > have > > > >> anything to do for the past couple of weeks doesn't mean they had to > sit > > > >> around and hop on every little problem we have. What happens when > > > updates > > > >> are released to address the current existing issues? Are you going > to > > > >> apologize for acting like a bunch of assholes or are you going to > feel > > > >> stupid for saying things like, "Valve doesn't care about their games > > > >> anymore"? Wait...I know. 90% of you will say, "Finally." 5% won't > be > > > >> happy no matter what. 4% will bring up another issue that Valve is > > > >> ignoring. And 1% will say, "Thank you." > > > >> > > > >> Yes, we paid money for the game. But $50 does not give you the > right to > > > >> treat the people trying to help you like shit. Sometimes the > problems > > > that > > > >> you claim are easy fixes may not be so easy to fix. And since most > of > > > you > > > >> know for a fact that it's an easy fix, there's always > > > [email protected] > > > >> . > > > >> > > > >> Grow up. They are aware of the problems. Like Aaron said, there > are > > > your > > > >> priorities and then there are business priorities. Just because the > > > issues > > > >> high on your list may not be high on theirs doesn't mean they're > > > ignoring > > > >> you. But then, it would be stupid of me to assume that most of you > > > would > > > >> understand any of that, especially given your attitudes over the > past > > > few > > > >> months. > > > >> > > > >> -Richard Eid > > > >> _______________________________________________ > > > >> To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list > archives, > > > please visit: > > > >> http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds > > > >> > > > > > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > > > > It's the same Hotmail(r). If by "same" you mean up to 70% faster. > > > > > > > > http://windowslive.com/online/hotmail?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_hotmail_acq_broad1_122008 > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list > archives, > > > please visit: > > > > http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list > archives, > > > please visit: > > > > http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, > > > please visit: > > > http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, > please visit: > > http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds > > _________________________________________________________________ > Send e-mail anywhere. No map, no compass. > > http://windowslive.com/oneline/hotmail?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_hotmail_acq_anywhere_122008 > _______________________________________________ > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, > please visit: > http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds > _______________________________________________ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds
