Finally! Something worth discussing! Bavarian beer! mmmmm... ;) I'll just add my two cents here. There is no other company that I know of that supports it's modding community as enthusiastically as Valve does, with the possible exception of Blizzard with the WoW gui modding community. Blizzard and Valve have a lot in common in that they don't abandon their wonderful old games. They are the only two gaming corporations that I know of that do this.
They aren't perfect, but they deserve some respect, and the occasional thank you. Drek Stefan Popp wrote: > Maybe :) > > I guess we start to understand what each other means :) > Let us discuss next time with a litre bavarian beer and "Weißwürste". > I pay ;) > > - Back to technical topics - > > Best regards, > Stefan Popp > > Evaldas, GameConnect schrieb: > >> Hey, I didn’t start teaching VALVe employees how to code. It’s easy for you >> to say. Did anyone of you release your own game engine? Maybe two? You >> people started the flame about “Hey VALVe, drop all your HL2 sources and >> rewrite it in C++”. And believe me, your comparing isn’t fear… Releasing >> COD4 means that COD2 is dead? Then Counter-Strike should be removed from >> steam game list, :-) because we have orangeBox. So, going back to the >> ethics, VALVe is doing a great job by supporting ALL of their games. Maybe >> the support isn’t so fast and their update priority list is… strange. But >> they are supporting ALL of their products. Even the 10-year old. I think >> that employees will see this spam and react to it. Do some global engine >> patching and everything will be ok. You say that someone has contacted them. >> What do we mean by contacting? Maybe someone mailed >> [email protected] about this bug and what? I bet that they get >> thousands of mails per day. It isn’t fear to say that they aware of the >> problem if they didn’t say so. >> >> Anyway, technical mailing list is not a place to flame and learn programmers >> how to code. :-) >> >> Evaldas, >> GameConnect, Lithuania >> www.gameconnect.lt >> >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Stefan Popp" <[email protected]> >> To: "Half-Life dedicated Linux server mailing list" >> <[email protected]> >> Sent: Wednesday, August 19, 2009 1:52 AM >> Subject: Re: [hlds_linux] Valve Source Engine Console Message Format String >> Vulnerability >> >> >> >> >>> I think our discusion will never end with our argumentations. iam >>> talking about ethic, and you talk about budget and resources ;) >>> At least, if you have a problems with a program you have to apply >>> pressure on the company how made it if you want fixes. >>> Thats the point of support. And COD2 is dead. After COD4 the mainstream >>> doesnt care about COD2. At least, COD4 is just a update. >>> Why fixing Windows 2000 if Windows XP doesnt have the bug anymore and >>> the support is expired? >>> >>> Finally, the current discussion is around latest games, and not stuff >>> which is 10 years old. >>> So, stop discuss about things which doesnt apply to the mainsteam =) >>> >>> Best regards, >>> Stefan Popp >>> >>> Evaldas Žilinskas schrieb: >>> >>> >>>> I wouldn’t call COD2 a game without bugs. :) When did we see last update? >>>> Oh >>>> yes… 3 years ago. :-) And talking about Microsoft… Their support is quite >>>> interesting. You call, they tell you how to use your control panel, but >>>> when >>>> we go back to the part, when bugs and exploits must be fixed… They decide >>>> directly from air witch exploits must be fixed and witch will remain for >>>> ever to deal with. We have Windows Vista, everyone is crying, people are >>>> dying… and what? We will get new Windows product, witch will cost money. >>>> Vista will remain slow working with its bugs and other things people paid >>>> money for. Everyone has a politics to do their commercial. I don’t blame >>>> Valve… >>>> >>>> Evaldas, >>>> GameConnect, Lithuania >>>> www.gameconnect.lt >>>> >>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>> From: "Stefan Popp" <[email protected]> >>>> To: "Half-Life dedicated Linux server mailing list" >>>> <[email protected]> >>>> Sent: Wednesday, August 19, 2009 12:59 AM >>>> Subject: Re: [hlds_linux] Valve Source Engine Console Message Format >>>> String >>>> Vulnerability >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>>> Thats true ;) >>>>> >>>>> Best example: SAP =D >>>>> >>>>> Oliver Salzburg schrieb: >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>> Well, some people just need 10 years to get their shit right... >>>>>> >>>>>> Evaldas Žilinskas wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>> Oh… Show me other company that still supports 10 year old games like >>>>>>> Half-Life, by providing community integration, Russian walk prevention >>>>>>> and >>>>>>> exploit fixing updates? Maybe EA :-)? These things cost money and they >>>>>>> are >>>>>>> not responsible because of some of dumb players, trying to use found >>>>>>> game >>>>>>> exploits as a cheat or as a way to hack something. They do their best >>>>>>> and I’m >>>>>>> sure about that. More customers you have, more exploits and bugs will >>>>>>> be >>>>>>> found. And… making a dialogue with everyone – it’s impossible. I own a >>>>>>> company with only a few thousand customers and even then it’s hard to >>>>>>> maintain everyone. How many customers VALVe has? >>>>>>> >>>>>>> players, >>>>>>> server admins, >>>>>>> source engine owners, >>>>>>> third party mod developers, >>>>>>> cybercafé owners, >>>>>>> content resellers, >>>>>>> steam store sellers… >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Hey Alfred, I’ve found a bug, answer me! Believe me – NOT so easy! >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Evaldas, >>>>>>> GameConnect, Lithuania >>>>>>> www.gameconnect.lt >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>>>>> From: "Stefan Popp" <[email protected]> >>>>>>> To: "Half-Life dedicated Linux server mailing list" >>>>>>> <[email protected]> >>>>>>> Sent: Tuesday, August 18, 2009 10:37 PM >>>>>>> Subject: Re: [hlds_linux] Valve Source Engine Console Message Format >>>>>>> String >>>>>>> Vulnerability >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Wheres the point? >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Its their product, and they have to support the product. If i code >>>>>>>> any >>>>>>>> application and i wait 4 weeks (or more :P) until i fix anything for >>>>>>>> my >>>>>>>> customers, i can go directly to die. >>>>>>>> I never said valve didnt support their products, but the point is, >>>>>>>> how >>>>>>>> they do that. And the royal way of support is fast fixing of bugs, >>>>>>>> and >>>>>>>> if providing sdk's, updating the materials around. And currently i >>>>>>>> think >>>>>>>> Valve makes bad support. Maybe, they kicked some programmers or >>>>>>>> somethin? But as customer i didnt care about their resources, i only >>>>>>>> care about theire reaction times if i got problems ;) or? >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Saint K. schrieb: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Imo VALVe is still the only one who cares and interacts so much with >>>>>>>>> their community. Yes they have their flaws, and they can be ugly at >>>>>>>>> times, but hey, what other dev mails you straight away when you >>>>>>>>> report >>>>>>>>> a >>>>>>>>> bug to resolve it? So far this only happends to me with VALVe. From >>>>>>>>> other >>>>>>>>> devs u should thank god on your knees to ever get any response at >>>>>>>>> all. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> The games are worth their money, and the suport on their games is >>>>>>>>> insanely long. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> VALVe still has and will continue to have my support. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Saint K. >>>>>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>>>>> From: [email protected] >>>>>>>>> [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of >>>>>>>>> Stefan >>>>>>>>> Popp >>>>>>>>> Sent: dinsdag 18 augustus 2009 20:51 >>>>>>>>> To: Half-Life dedicated Linux server mailing list >>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [hlds_linux] Valve Source Engine Console Message Format >>>>>>>>> String Vulnerability >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> The wish is currently present ;) >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Due a lot of stuff valve didnt managed the right way ;) >>>>>>>>> 1. bad code and many ways to crash servers from client side >>>>>>>>> 2. changing engine stuff without telling plugin developer about >>>>>>>>> changes >>>>>>>>> or any new sdk's >>>>>>>>> 3. no statements about this and a lot of other points ;) >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> there are a lot of reasons why i wish to get my money back, but i >>>>>>>>> still >>>>>>>>> hope that valve goes back to their roots and care about theire >>>>>>>>> community >>>>>>>>> ;) >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Best regards, >>>>>>>>> Stefan Popp >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Adam Nowacki schrieb: >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> You'd wish you never bought any Valve games the day this happens. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Stefan Popp wrote: >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Sorry, but this must be corrected ;) >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> -"Valve should start coding c++ with steams ;)" >>>>>>>>>>> +"Valve should start coding c++ with streams ;)" >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Best regards, >>>>>>>>>>> Stefan Popp >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Stefan Popp schrieb: >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> Well, >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> Valve should start coding c++ with steams ;) >>>>>>>>>>>> Who works with printfs today? >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> I hope Valve will fix the whole source to prevent overflows. >>>>>>>>>>>> C++ is you friend, not old C stuff... >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> Best regards, >>>>>>>>>>>> Stefan Popp >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> Claudio Beretta schrieb: >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> Thanks, anyone knows if a workaround is available? >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> BTW: aren't "security researchers" supposed to contact the >>>>>>>>>>>>> developers >>>>>>>>>>>>> before >>>>>>>>>>>>> releasing 0-day exploits?This is the 2nd 0-day exploy from >>>>>>>>>>>>> aluigi >>>>>>>>>>>>> in >>>>>>>>>>>>> a few >>>>>>>>>>>>> weeks -.- >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> On Tue, Aug 18, 2009 at 6:44 PM, Morgan Humes >>>>>>>>>>>>> <[email protected]> >>>>>>>>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> A friend forwarded me this info regarding a vulnerability. I >>>>>>>>>>>>>> am >>>>>>>>>>>>>> unable to >>>>>>>>>>>>>> test this at the moment, but it does look like it is possible. >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Thought I >>>>>>>>>>>>>> would get this out to the community before others start using >>>>>>>>>>>>>> this >>>>>>>>>>>>>> to cause >>>>>>>>>>>>>> havoc. >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://www.vupen.com/english/advisories/2009/2296 >>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://aluigi.altervista.org/adv/sourcefs-adv.txt >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Morgan Humes >>>>>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list >>>>>>>>>>>>>> archives, >>>>>>>>>>>>>> please visit: >>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list >>>>>>>>>>>>> archives, please visit: >>>>>>>>>>>>> http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list >>>>>>>>>>>> archives, >>>>>>>>>>>> please visit: >>>>>>>>>>>> http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list >>>>>>>>>>> archives, >>>>>>>>>>> please visit: >>>>>>>>>>> http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list >>>>>>>>>> archives, >>>>>>>>>> please visit: >>>>>>>>>> http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list >>>>>>>>> archives, >>>>>>>>> please visit: >>>>>>>>> http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> No virus found in this incoming message. >>>>>>>>> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com >>>>>>>>> Version: 8.5.409 / Virus Database: 270.13.58/2309 - Release Date: >>>>>>>>> 08/18/09 06:03:00 >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list >>>>>>>>> archives, >>>>>>>>> please visit: >>>>>>>>> http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list >>>>>>>> archives, >>>>>>>> please visit: >>>>>>>> http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, >>>>>>> please visit: >>>>>>> http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, >>>>>> please visit: >>>>>> http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, >>>>> please visit: >>>>> http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, >>>> please visit: >>>> http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, >>> please visit: >>> http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux >>> >>> >>> >> _______________________________________________ >> To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, >> please visit: >> http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux >> >> > > > _______________________________________________ > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please > visit: > http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux > _______________________________________________ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux
