I can't believe Valve is taking such a stance on this. ROBIIIIIN! Time to rally your troops, yet again.
-TheG On Sat, Oct 29, 2011 at 1:47 AM, Nicholas Hastings <[email protected] > wrote: > I don't know why you would expect them to add more public interfaces when > they don't even share the changes to the existing ones. > > When was the last Source 2009 SDK update? Oh wait, there is no (official) > Source 2009 SDK. > > > On 10/28/2011 7:35 PM, Saul Rennison wrote: > >> Here's what I've got so far msleeper: >> http://pastie.org/private/**v7cygkomvwkh0eeprut1a<http://pastie.org/private/v7cygkomvwkh0eeprut1a> >> >> >> Kind regards, >> *Saul Rennison* >> >> >> On 28 October 2011 22:08, >> msleeper<msleeper@**ismsleeperwrong.com<[email protected]>> >> wrote: >> >> Personally I'm staying away from "make things better for everyone by >>> exposing code" arguments since I doubt it will happen, and I'm >>> sticking to the "if you don't want SourceMod to be required, add in >>> what it does to the core game" argument for now. >>> >>> On Fri, Oct 28, 2011 at 4:31 PM, Saul >>> Rennison<saul.rennison@gmail.**com<[email protected]> >>> > >>> wrote: >>> >>>> Abstract your gamerules and game players into interfaces (IGameRules, >>>> ITFGameRules, one for each mod or gamemode and ITFPlayer, ICSPlayer, >>>> etc) >>>> and expose them, that removes any need for offsets. Also expose IClient >>>> >>> and >>> >>>> IServer from the engine, why are they hidden? >>>> >>>> I'm currently in the process of doing the former part of my suggestion >>>> >>> for >>> >>>> CSProMod (just one programmer) and I plan to have it done within 2 days. >>>> Minimal expense for Valve and a huge plus for plugin developers. >>>> >>>> >>>> Kind regards, >>>> *Saul Rennison* >>>> >>>> >>>> On 28 October 2011 21:21, Henry >>>> Goffin<henryg@valvesoftware.**com<[email protected]>> >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>> A very interesting question! No answer for you yet, unfortunately. >>>>> >>>>> We don't like the fact that managing a Source server requires third >>>>> >>>> party >>> >>>> software. We definitely appreciate everything that SM/MM do, and we >>>>> obviously don't have anything against them and we aren't breaking them >>>>> >>>> on >>> >>>> purpose. But we still aren't happy with the stability problems around >>>>> updates, even if they're often caused by admins who don't update >>>>> >>>> promptly >>> >>>> and not necessarily SM's fault. We are trying to find a better long-term >>>>> solution. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>> From: >>>>> hlds_linux-bounces@list.**valvesoftware.com<[email protected]>[mailto: >>>>> hlds_linux-bounces@list.**valvesoftware.com<[email protected]>] >>>>> On Behalf Of msleeper >>>>> Sent: Friday, October 28, 2011 1:11 PM >>>>> To: Half-Life dedicated Linux server mailing list >>>>> Subject: Re: [hlds_linux] Players cannot taunt or call for medic >>>>> >>>>> Henry - >>>>> >>>>> Should we expect Source to include an extensive set of administrative >>>>> tools in the near future then? SM / MM are third party software, yes, >>>>> but they're absolutely essential in "keeping the peace" as Source's >>>>> current administrative tools are nonexistent. >>>>> >>>>> On Fri, Oct 28, 2011 at 4:05 PM, Henry Goffin<henryg@valvesoftware.** >>>>> com <[email protected]> >>>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Just because we haven't put out one of these reminders in a while... >>>>>> >>>>>> Sourcemod hooks into undocumented engine code and generally doesn't >>>>>> >>>>> play >>> >>>> well with updates. Whenever we make an engine change, Sourcemod starts >>>>> calling the wrong functions. This can cause all kinds of issues ranging >>>>> >>>> from >>> >>>> server instability to client crashes to incorrect physics or gameplay. >>>>> Usually a new Sourcemod release comes out which has reverse-engineered >>>>> >>>> the >>> >>>> engine changes and makes everything "work" again, but we have nothing to >>>>> >>>> do >>> >>>> with it. We obviously can't promise that your server will be stable or >>>>> >>>> even >>> >>>> work properly if you choose to run this type of engine-hooking mod. >>>>> >>>>>> Lately our updates have been including more engine changes as we work >>>>>> >>>>> to >>> >>>> support new features like misc slots, loadouts, replay, holiday game >>>>> >>>> modes, >>> >>>> etc. This does mean that recent updates are much more likely to break >>>>> Sourcemod plugins than in the past. >>>>> >>>>>> We wouldn't say, "never use Sourcemod", but I'd personally caution >>>>>> >>>>> against it unless you absolutely rely on its functionality. Our >>>>> >>>> automated >>> >>>> crash report tools are always flooded by sourcemod and metamod crashes >>>>> whenever we release an update, and this time has been no exception. >>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>> From: >>>>>> hlds_linux-bounces@list.**valvesoftware.com<[email protected]>[mailto: >>>>>> >>>>> hlds_linux-bounces@list.**valvesoftware.com<[email protected]>] >>>>> On Behalf Of Andrew >>>>> >>>>>> Sent: Friday, October 28, 2011 12:37 PM >>>>>> To: Half-Life dedicated Linux server mailing list >>>>>> Subject: Re: [hlds_linux] Players cannot taunt or call for medic >>>>>> >>>>>> EHG, >>>>>> >>>>>> Huge thanks for that find! I believe it did the trick. >>>>>> >>>>>> May I ask where you got your updated offset values? I checked my usual >>>>>> location at: >>>>>> http://www.sourcemodplugins.**org/pages/vtableoffsets/<http://www.sourcemodplugins.org/pages/vtableoffsets/>but >>>>>> they appear to be out of date. (Last updated on Oct 21). >>>>>> >>>>>> If you have a better source I would greatly appreciate it! >>>>>> >>>>>> Thanks >>>>>> -Andrew >>>>>> >>>>>> On Fri, Oct 28, 2011 at 12:32 PM, EHG<[email protected]> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> I ran into this same problem. It turned out to be incorrect offsets >>>>>>> >>>>>> for >>> >>>> the >>>>> >>>>>> team balance forward. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> "CanBeAutobalanced" >>>>>>> { >>>>>>> "windows" "449" >>>>>>> "linux" "450" >>>>>>> } >>>>>>> >>>>>>> -EHG >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On 10/28/2011 11:05 AM, Andrew wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Since the halloween update last night, every now and then I get a >>>>>>>> player complaining that they cannot taunt or call for a medic on >>>>>>>> koth_viaduct_event. Has anyone else seen this? >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> I cannot tell if there is a real issue here, or if I have some >>>>>>>> >>>>>>> players >>> >>>> with screwed up keybindings who keep coming back. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Thanks >>>>>>>> -Andrew >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> ______________________________**_________________ >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list >>>>>>> >>>>>> archives, >>> >>>> please visit: >>>>>>> http://list.valvesoftware.com/**mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux<http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> -- >>>>>> Andrew (Wave Admin) >>>>>> The Wave! >>>>>> 24/7 CTF >>>>>> 1/2 respawn times >>>>>> http://thewaveserver.com >>>>>> >>>>>> ______________________________**_________________ >>>>>> To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, >>>>>> >>>>> please visit: >>>>> >>>>>> http://list.valvesoftware.com/**mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux<http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux> >>>>>> >>>>>> ______________________________**_________________ >>>>>> To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, >>>>>> >>>>> please visit: >>>>> >>>>>> http://list.valvesoftware.com/**mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux<http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux> >>>>>> >>>>>> ______________________________**_________________ >>>>> To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, >>>>> please visit: >>>>> http://list.valvesoftware.com/**mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux<http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux> >>>>> >>>>> ______________________________**_________________ >>>>> To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, >>>>> please visit: >>>>> http://list.valvesoftware.com/**mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux<http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux> >>>>> >>>>> ______________________________**_________________ >>>> To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, >>>> >>> please visit: >>> >>>> http://list.valvesoftware.com/**mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux<http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux> >>>> >>>> ______________________________**_________________ >>> To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, >>> please visit: >>> http://list.valvesoftware.com/**mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux<http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux> >>> >>> ______________________________**_________________ >> To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, >> please visit: >> http://list.valvesoftware.com/**mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux<http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux> >> > > > ______________________________**_________________ > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, > please visit: > http://list.valvesoftware.com/**mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux<http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux> > _______________________________________________ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux
