I think both solder and crimp have their place. When you're doing a
connection to a terminal strip, there's obviously no question that you
use a crimped fitting. Although I will admit I have been known from
time to time to just twist the wire, bend it into a loop, then tighten
it under the screw head as a temporary fix when a crimp connector isn't
available
A wire-to-wire connection, though, can be either crimped or soldered. I
don't see any problem with a properly soldered connection if it's got a
waterproof heat-shrink tubing over it and it's looped and secured so
that any tension on either end of the wire does not pull on the
connection. As to vibration, unless the connection is actually on the
engine, I can't think of any location on the boat where it would be an
issue. The wire is certainly less flexible in the 1/2 inch or so length
where the solder has penetrated it, but if the connection is
mechanically secured in a loop with something like a wire-tie, it should
be fine for years.
Lee Scott
'87 C-26 #6350
On 7/29/2010 6:23 PM, Ralph Ahseln wrote:
Hey Phil,
I don't disagree with your assessment at all. In fact I Crimp most of
my fittings. I reserve Soldering for the proper and timely applications.
It's quite true that a Bad soldering is bad in many ways.
It's also true that a poor Crimp (even with a ratchet tool) is as bad.
By the way, I have and can, teach how to solder properly in less than
an hour.
I guess the problem I have with most comments about soldering is the
mythology that seems to follow it.
That doing it somehow "Weakens" the wire/connection.
(I've even heard it used to discourage someone from Tinning a bare
wire. ?? ).
Even the line often said.. "vibration prone" needs a good deal more
explanation. Too often it's used as a "mysterious" threat.
There's even a kind of thinking that it's the OLD Fashioned way.
As in Most things of this nature, THE....Where, What, When and Type of
Application.. should be paramount in explanations.
IMHO, Both methods should be taught. Then the argument would be over. LOL
To simply say to use a Crimper may be misleading. And sure as hell
it's and expensive tool for a Do it yourself person. IMHO.
For me personally, I would be reluctant to suggest someone spend
nearly $100 for a ratchet crimper ..
.... to do ONE or TWO splices or connectors....When a soldered
connector, a liberal covering of Glue Gun Glue (it's what's in an
Adhesive Heat Shrink connector), and some inexpensive heat shrink
tubing, would cost under a couple of bucks.. And last as well.
The Crimp is a wonderful development for us in the world of Electrics,
but has some draw backs as well.
The incorrect Die, improper tension, and not the least of which, poor
"Lay" of the wire strands... All can make a bad crimp.
As to "vibration prone". There should be a discussion about the
mechanical stress put on copper wire by the "Shear Pressure" of crimping.
Yes, I suppose there have been tests done to "Prove" one better than
the other, And, I'm sure there is a ton of Anecdotal experiences ( I
never trust a memory or observation that's Second Hand).... But, What
we do here on our boats is NOT Rocket Science.
The "G" forces seen in a Catalina 27 or 270 surely are a BIT less than
the Mars Probes !
Me? I use both methods. I paid the high price for a Ratchet Crimp Tool
because I had a lot of Electrical connections to do .. on MY boat and
on a couple of Friend's boats.. The Ability to make up Many connectors
in a short time .. without having to deal with a heated iron,
rosin core solder, Adhesive glue and tubing, was the reason I bought
the Crimper,
But, when project Fits....(like most UNDER water applications)
or, the occasion arises and the iron is near, I'll do a Soldering job.
What I'd love to see is more of a practical approach to Advice and
Council on our Forums.
Suggestions of Many Options and Other Methods, rather than a One Size
Fits All... or the suggestion of " I wouldn't do it THAT way"...
Or, what is Anathema to me... To simple "Throw Money at the Problem"
As I said, I'd like us to lay out all the possibilities open to the Do
It Yourselfer, rather than scare the Bejesus out of them.
With Respect as Always,
ralph ahseln
"Oblio"
Lying: Portland OR
*From:* Phil Agur <mailto:[email protected]>
*Sent:* Thursday, July 29, 2010 2:59 PM
*To:* [email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>
*Subject:* RE: [IC27A] Long time lurker......1st time poster
Hi Ralph,
You can buy wire where the strands are tin plated or you can buy wire
where the bundle of strands is "tinned" with an over coat of solder.
The "tinned" is more prone to vibration failure.
I think our only disagreement on soldering is how long it takes to
become an expert at soldering. I'd guess more than 75% (ok right out
of the air) of the folks that think they know how to solder actual
don't and get luck from time to time. It takes a good 2 or 3 days of
instruction to learn how to solder and the certification test is
several hours. On the other hand I can tell someone which terminals
and crimper to use and be fairly assured they will achieve a quality
connection as a result.
I'm not opposed to soldering, having lectured on soldering techniques
at 26 assembly sites in the US for Intel one year, I'm just certain
it's not something that is easy to pick up on your own.
*Phil Agur* */s/v/** Wing Tip*
<http://www.catalina27.org/public_pages/profile270.htm>
C270 LE #184 MMSI 366901790
*From:* [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] *On
Behalf Of *Ralph Ahseln
*Sent:* Thursday, July 29, 2010 1:24 PM
*To:* [email protected]
*Subject:* Re: [IC27A] Long time lurker......1st time poster
Huh ?
What ?
Explain please .
(As many old timers here know, Phil and I have had a long term ,
friendly, disagreement about Soldering and Tinning.)
Respectfully,
Ralph Ahseln
"Oblio"
*From:* Phil Agur <mailto:[email protected]>
"........ It should be tin plated stranded copper wire but not
"Tinned" in theory*......"*
