Hey, This sounds amazingly like one of Harry Sacks relatives. eh? :-) Have great weekend everybody.
David ----- Original Message ----- From: "Rick Peacock" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Friday, November 30, 2001 3:40 PM Subject: Re: Re[4]: [IMail Forum] New IMail Anti-Virus ad Declude > Okay, well tell ya what....you spend 6 months paying lots of talented > developers good salaries to improve a product and sell it for $500 and > you'll be gone in less than a year. But hey, you aren't doing this to make > money, right? You whine about price all the time, as if that were the only > factor. And to top it all off, they finally give you what you ask for, and > you do nothing but complain about the price. Tell me something. Is it work > $7,850 to keep your 1500 employees virus free? Think of the time and money > saved if you can keep viruses off of all the desktops in an organization > without buying 1500 copies of an anti-virus program. The math works. > > As for Scott helping with Declude, I am sure he is quite competent. He seems > to be able to make you happy where IPSwitch cannot. If you have that > solution already, where is all this hostility coming from? Surely you cannot > expect IPSwitch to just "eat" the cost of developing this most important > module that people like yourself have been asking for? > > And you should make up your mind. You posted earlier: > > "Now after I begged for this solution for years, and Imail > just sits there on their hands, they now introduce a new > intergrated solution today charging thousands just like the > big antivirus companies, instead of partnering with Declude > for more rational ethical solutions, with more features, at > the fraction of the costs." > > and now you're changing that with "Beyond that, at least the way I do > business, if I can make a product that works better without laying another > whole product > on top of mine at ten times the cost, well, I just think that's the way > business should be done." So they should've partnered with Declude, is that > what this is all about? You know, Yahoo!, one of the largest Internet > portals out there, doesn't use Declude to scan their email. Why don't you > flame them? > > I am sure the product will deliver just what it promises. IPSwitch has never > released software that wasn't useful and stable. WS_FTP was around before > the public even knew what the Internet was! It's one thing to suggest > something useful. It's another to flame a company because they didn't do it > YOUR way. Seems to me you already have a solution using IMGate and Declude. > So use it and quit whining because your organization can't afford a $7850 > solution that works. Tech support isn't a volunteer vocation. In an idea > world, everything would be free. But this is the real world, and people > don't work for free..especially talented people. Give IPSwitch a break. They > have to pay the bills just like eveyone else, and better products mean > higher prices. > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Roger Heath" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > To: "Rick Peacock" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Sent: Friday, November 30, 2001 2:55 PM > Subject: Re[4]: [IMail Forum] New IMail Anti-Virus ad Declude > > > > Reply to: Rick Peacock > > Re: [IMail Forum] New IMail Anti-Virus ad Declude on Friday 12:18:56 > PM > > > > I've also been with Imail since version 3.x, so I have been here > > just as long. And I was asking for a trully integrated Imail > > antivirus solution for over three years, right in this forum. > > I got an opportunity to get SSL and a $1000 calendar and a few > > goodies when the single most important step Imail could have > > taken three years ago was add some kind of antivirus product. > > > > Three years, and the only one who helped me was Scott with Declude, > > not Ipswitch. We were planning on abandoning Imail until Scott > > came along. I wonder how many people kept Imail because of Scott? > > IMHO, Declude is much more elegant than setting up another separate > > server with more open ports using substantially more resources > > on the same machine) and 'double server processing' mail from one > > to the other. > > > > Beyond that, at least the way I do business, if I can make a > > product that works better without laying another whole product > > on top of mine at ten times the cost, well, I just think that's > > the way business should be done. I have always thought that if I > > can provide a more competitive product that is easier to run and > > is far more cost effetive for my customers, and more secure, > > that's the easy choice I should make from a marketing perspective. > > That's in the best interest of my customers. > > > > If I were a customer who understood all the benefits of each > > avenue or choice and you were asking me to purchase a product > > with half the features at ten times the price I'd have to question > > whether you were acting on my behalf. I'd also have to question > > if your objective was really 'to improve your product'. Right > > now I'd have to say no. > > > > -- > > Roger Heath > > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > > ----- Copy of Original Message(s): ----- > > > > R> Roger, > > > > R> You seem to think that charging more for a product to a customer who is > > R> "not-so-saavy" seems unfair? Let's take a look at the marketplace as a > > R> whole. I am sure that everyone on this list uses a product with lots of > > R> third-party add-ons - WINDOWS! So you think that by charging the money > > R> Symantec charges, when "saavy" people use the free McAfee scanner, > Symantec > > R> is out of line? Puh-lease! IPSwitch is just like any other company - > > R> striving to improve their product. > > > > R> So they didn't choose someone cheaper. If you're so smart in marketing, > then > > R> tell me this - who would you partner with? Someone with worldwide name > > R> recognition, or someone that almost no one in the business world has > ever > > R> heard of? Do you have any IDEA how many people buy NAV and even > > R> SUBSCRIPTIONS because of name recognition alone?! > > > > R> IPSwitch even told you that they SUPPORT 3RD PARTY SOLUTIONS! If you > don't > > R> like the IPSwitch solution, you, as a "saavy" user, can opt not to buy > the > > R> NAV module and use your other options instead. The reality is, if no > one > > R> buys the more expensive modules, then maybe they look at a more > > R> cost-effective solution. > > > > R> I've been with Imail for years (since version 3.0). They started out as > a > > R> small company with a fantastic product that was very modestly priced. > With > > R> improvements in the product, prices have risen. So what?! The product > out > > R> today(even WITH the AntiVirus module) is a hundred times better than > the > > R> original because that's the way it's supposed to be! As the product > evolves > > R> so does it's cost. Price is based on the VALUE of the product - not > what > > R> one small group of people think it should cost. If you don't like the > > R> price then vote with your wallet. So what if it costs more? IPSwitch is > not > > R> a charity - it's a BUSINESS. Businesses make money (oooh! What a > concept! A > > R> web business that makes money? How dare they!).You want cheap? Use some > of > > R> the FREEWARE mail servers and use this list for support, as it was > > R> intended - not as a way to take cheap shots at a company that doesn't > do > > R> EXACTLY what YOU think it should. > > > > R> Rick > > R> ----- Original Message ----- > > R> From: "Roger Heath" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > R> To: "Bob McGregor" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > R> Cc: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > R> Sent: Wednesday, November 28, 2001 2:15 PM > > R> Subject: Re[2]: [IMail Forum] New IMail Anti-Virus ad Declude > > > > > > >> Reply to: Bob McGregor > > >> Re: [IMail Forum] New IMail Anti-Virus ad Declude on Wednesday > > R> 12:53:53 PM > > >> > > >> Very well put. Even Mail Essentials is one-third the > > >> price with maybe 50-100 more features depending how > > >> you look at it and you can still use what ever command > > >> line scanner you want. But it will still not be as > > >> integrated and low in cost and efficient and unique > > >> to Imail as Declude. > > >> > > >> Taking advantage of 'not-so-savvy' customers to this degree > > >> is not a pretty picture of a company at all. > > >> > > >> BTW, I have received a private email from the CTO of > > >> Ipswitch that indicates they intend to continue to > > >> support apps like Declude and 3rd party development > > >> and not block them. I hope that is always the case. > > >> > > >> -- > > >> Roger Heath > > >> [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > >> > > >> Reply to: Don Weber > > >> Re: [IMail Forum] New IMail Anti-Virus ad Declude on Wednesday > > R> 12:08:00 PM > > >> > > >> B> you musta missed the last 2 weeks of this list, this has been round > and > > R> round a few > > >> B> times, and lots of users feel the > > >> > > >> Not really. I just received the formal announcement of > > >> Imail AntiVirus this morning. > > >> > > >> ----- Copy of Original Message(s): ----- > > >> > > >> B> Don Says: > > >> > > >> >>IPSwitch will most likely enjoy success making the big dollar sales > with > > >> >>the big dollar and big name oriented consumers or those who don't > take > > >> >>the time and get educated. > > >> > > >> B> This is true and they will get sales.... but imagine you're new to > > >> B> Imail and you purchase the Imail and AV stuff from them and then > find > > >> B> out about this list. > > >> > > >> B> You subscribe (like we all did) and then you find out there's a > > >> B> solution that is way less money AND the existing people (experts in > > >> B> your eyes) all highly tout it.... AND you find out it's been > > >> B> there longer! > > >> > > >> B> Would you not wonder why they just bent you over for thousands of > > R> bucks?? > > >> > > >> B> Major question is "Why does Ipswitch not value it's existing > customer > > >> B> base or it's 3rd party folks???" > > >> > > >> B> bob > > >> > > >> > > >> Please visit http://www.ipswitch.com/support/mailing-lists.html > > >> to be removed from this list. > > >> > > >> An Archive of this list is available at: > > >> http://www.mail-archive.com/imail_forum%40list.ipswitch.com/ > > >> > > > > > > R> Please visit http://www.ipswitch.com/support/mailing-lists.html > > R> to be removed from this list. > > > > R> An Archive of this list is available at: > > R> http://www.mail-archive.com/imail_forum%40list.ipswitch.com/ > > > > > > Please visit http://www.ipswitch.com/support/mailing-lists.html > > to be removed from this list. > > > > An Archive of this list is available at: > > http://www.mail-archive.com/imail_forum%40list.ipswitch.com/ > > > > > Please visit http://www.ipswitch.com/support/mailing-lists.html > to be removed from this list. > > An Archive of this list is available at: > http://www.mail-archive.com/imail_forum%40list.ipswitch.com/ > Please visit http://www.ipswitch.com/support/mailing-lists.html to be removed from this list. An Archive of this list is available at: http://www.mail-archive.com/imail_forum%40list.ipswitch.com/
