Dear Samir, I am not capable of studying the links you have provided. It is beyond my limits of understanding :-) Moreover, it is not good for just two of us to aggressively discuss over these two species.
We must and will take a pause here and let others voice their opinions and views. Regards. Dinesh On Sat, Oct 31, 2015 at 5:32 AM, Samir Mehta <[email protected]> wrote: > https://archive.org/stream/revisionofgenfisher#page/402/mode/2up > > You will find the keys to the genus on above weblink. > > Rgds, > > > > On Sat, Oct 31, 2015 at 5:25 AM, Samir Mehta <[email protected]> > wrote: > >> >> >> <https://archive.org/stream/revisionofgenfisher#page/444/mode/2up/search/cosmos+caudatus> >> https://archive.org/details/*revision*ofgenfisher >> >> https://archive.org/details/revisionofgenfisher >> >> <https://archive.org/stream/revisionofgenfisher#page/444/mode/2up/search/cosmos+caudatus> >> >> >> >> <https://archive.org/stream/revisionofgenfisher#page/444/mode/2up/search/cosmos+caudatus> >> >> >> https://archive.org/stream/revisionofgenfisher#page/444/mode/2up/search/cosmos+caudatus >> >> (above page most specific for C. diversifolius) >> >> >> https://archive.org/stream/revisionofgenfisher#page/412/mode/2up/search/cosmos+caudatus >> >> (above page most specific for C. caudatus >> >> >> I have found a publication called 'Revsion of genus Cosmos' and given >> links to 2 of the most specific pages wrt C. caudaus an C. diversifolius; >> However most of the stuff is in Latin (I do not know Latin), some in >> English. As I cannot read all of it - even parts specific to C. cudatus and >> diversifolius - I do not want to hazard a guess. [All I can say is that >> achene of my plant is 2-aristate.]. >> >> >> Kindly go through the same and give your views. >> >> >> Regards, >> >> >> Samir Mehta >> >> >> On Thursday, October 29, 2015 at 5:42:37 PM UTC+5:30, Samir Mehta wrote: >>> >>> 'Rather than digging into keys of exotic flora, if we get to know the >>> facts / history of their introduction, that may serve our purpose. I >>> strongly believe only one of these was introduced in India.' >>> >>> I did read that in your initial mail but told myself - How does it >>> matter? C. caudatus may have been introduced on a larger scale but there >>> may have been introduction of C. diversifolius also (and not so well >>> documented or by accident). >>> >>> It's also true that if you do not have a complete set of images / data >>> you have limited choice. >>> >>> OK....Let's split the labour.... I try to dig out the keys / papers and >>> you try dig out the historical facts! >>> >>> Regards, >>> >>> On Thu, Oct 29, 2015 at 5:23 PM, Dinesh Valke <[email protected]> >>> wrote: >>> >>>> Samir, I marked a copy to Tabish because my plant features in Flowers >>>> of India >>>> <http://www.flowersofindia.net/catalog/slides/Wild%20Cosmos.html> :-) >>>> He should be aware of the outcome of this discussion; he may even share >>>> his thoughts. >>>> Hopefully Shrikant ji also gives his thoughts. >>>> >>>> Rather than digging into keys of exotic flora, if we get to know the >>>> facts / history of their introduction, that may serve our purpose. I >>>> strongly believe only one of these was introduced in India. >>>> >>>> Regards. >>>> Dinesh >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> On Thu, Oct 29, 2015 at 4:58 PM, Samir Mehta <[email protected]> >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>>> I had relied on FoS for the id. Now that stands challenged – and for >>>>> good reason. >>>>> >>>>> Point well taken; Agree with your concerns Dinesh. >>>>> >>>>> The two species seem to be very closely related. [I will post one >>>>> Alisycarpus where I am having similar difficulty] >>>>> >>>>> Objective: is to take a bipartisan approach to resolving the id (not >>>>> only two of us but the entire group - that's what a group is for in the >>>>> first place). >>>>> >>>>> I suggest: >>>>> >>>>> 1. We try and get relevant keys of genus Cosmos. >>>>> 2. Some scientific paper on the genus or something even more specific. >>>>> 3. In Asteraceae the bracts are important, so the reverse of the >>>>> flower face is important to demonstrate. >>>>> >>>>> . >>>>> >>>>> I am marking this mail to Shrikant Ingalhalikar also (you have already >>>>> marked mail to Tabish). It will be helpful if the two gentlemen share >>>>> there >>>>> views also as we have relied on their respective works. >>>>> >>>>> I am also adding one more image to add more data on the species >>>>> photographed by me. If you have more revealing images of your specimen >>>>> please share them (or link) with this thread. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Rgds, >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On Thu, Oct 29, 2015 at 10:26 AM, Dinesh Valke <[email protected] >>>>> > wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> At the University of Michigan pages, the Notes are as follows ... >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> *C. diversifolius* >>>>>> http://quod.lib.umich.edu/h/herb2ic/x-mich1108999/mich1108999___tif >>>>>> Notes >>>>>> Pine-oak forests west of summits Occasional, mostly past flower. *Rays >>>>>> white, disk yellow*. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> *C. caudatus* >>>>>> http://quod.lib.umich.edu/h/herb2ic/x-mich1108998/MICH1108998.TIF >>>>>> Notes >>>>>> Ungrazed hillsides in Bouteloua grassland Abundant on banks and >>>>>> disturbed ground. Annual to 2 m. high; selected small specimens; *rays >>>>>> deep pink, paler after opening, and often white toward base; disk yellow* >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Regards. >>>>>> Dinesh >>>>>> >>>>>> On Thu, Oct 29, 2015 at 10:19 AM, Dinesh Valke < >>>>>> [email protected]> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> Thanks Samir for working out to get the references used for arriving >>>>>>> to *C. diversifolius*. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Yes, Shrikant ji's 3rd book does show a picture of *C. >>>>>>> diversifolius* matching posted plant's flower. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Let us view a link related to *C. caudatus* in Wikimedia ... >>>>>>> https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Cosmos_caudatus >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> and the herbarium link ... >>>>>>> http://quod.lib.umich.edu/h/herb2ic/x-mich1108998/MICH1108998.TIF >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Somehow the content at both the links provided by you / me match the >>>>>>> posted plant. >>>>>>> We thus need someone to help us understand which of the two species >>>>>>> was introduced in India. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Regards. >>>>>>> Dinesh >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On Thu, Oct 29, 2015 at 4:01 AM, Samir Mehta <[email protected] >>>>>>> > wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> For the more technical, visit: >>>>>>>> http://quod.lib.umich.edu/h/herb2ic/x-mich1108999/mich1108999___tif >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Rgds, >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On Thu, Oct 29, 2015 at 12:31 AM, Dinesh Valke < >>>>>>>> [email protected]> wrote: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Thanks all for having consensus on *Cosmos diversifolius*. >>>>>>>>> I had posted my plant to the group with the ID of *C. caudatus*. >>>>>>>>> It was not validated positively (nor in negative until today). >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> This ID of *Cosmos diversifolius* is not convincing me. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Both *C. diversifolius >>>>>>>>> <http://www.ars-grin.gov/cgi-bin/npgs/html/taxon.pl?11682>* and *C. >>>>>>>>> caudatus <http://www.ars-grin.gov/cgi-bin/npgs/html/taxon.pl?11681>* >>>>>>>>> are native of Latin America, Not sure if *C. diversifolius* has >>>>>>>>> naturalized in our country - not mentioned in NPGS pages, rather *C. >>>>>>>>> caudatus* seems to have naturalized in larger part of eastern >>>>>>>>> hemisphere including India. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Results in image search on Google for these two species >>>>>>>>> *diversifolius* & *caudatus* match more to *C. caudatus*. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Dear friends, I have put my thoughts, please validate. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Regards. >>>>>>>>> Dinesh >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> On Wed, Oct 28, 2015 at 11:35 PM, Samir Mehta < >>>>>>>>> [email protected]> wrote: >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Yes Dinesh, plant has been incorrectly identified on the group. >>>>>>>>>> No wonder I did not find it when I searched for it. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Paresh ji, your images are superb. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Rgds, >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Samir Mehta >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> On Wednesday, October 28, 2015 at 11:09:05 PM UTC+5:30, >>>>>>>>>> pareshchuri wrote: >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Wonderful images Samir ji ! >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Yes Dinesh ji, I have also photographed this plant from >>>>>>>>>>> Tungreshwar WLS & got identified from Sushant More. >>>>>>>>>>> It can be viewed here- >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> http://www.ifoundbutterflies.org/nectar-plants/969/Cosmos-diversifolius >>>>>>>>>>> <http://www.google.com/url?q=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.ifoundbutterflies.org%2Fnectar-plants%2F969%2FCosmos-diversifolius&sa=D&sntz=1&usg=AFQjCNEalkP5gbpO1_d6C7_kLKuRsB949Q> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Regards >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> On Wed, Oct 28, 2015 at 9:59 PM, Dinesh Valke < >>>>>>>>>>> [email protected]> wrote: >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> Thanks Samir for sharing this plant; I have similar (seen >>>>>>>>>>>> planted at Tungareshwar WLS) and was under the impression that it >>>>>>>>>>>> is *Cosmos >>>>>>>>>>>> caudatus* Kunth. >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> Regards. >>>>>>>>>>>> Dinesh >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> On Wed, Oct 28, 2015 at 9:12 PM, Samir Mehta < >>>>>>>>>>>> [email protected]> wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> Wild flower @ S Gujarat, October. >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> New addition to group data base. >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> Regards, >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> Samir Mehta >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the >>>>>>>>>>>>> Google Groups "efloraofindia" group. >>>>>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from >>>>>>>>>>>>> it, send an email to [email protected]. >>>>>>>>>>>>> To post to this group, send email to >>>>>>>>>>>>> [email protected]. >>>>>>>>>>>>> Visit this group at >>>>>>>>>>>>> http://groups.google.com/group/indiantreepix. >>>>>>>>>>>>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the >>>>>>>>>>>> Google Groups "efloraofindia" group. >>>>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from >>>>>>>>>>>> it, send an email to [email protected]. >>>>>>>>>>>> To post to this group, send email to [email protected] >>>>>>>>>>>> . >>>>>>>>>>>> Visit this group at >>>>>>>>>>>> http://groups.google.com/group/indiantreepix. >>>>>>>>>>>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to a topic in the >> Google Groups "efloraofindia" group. >> To unsubscribe from this topic, visit >> https://groups.google.com/d/topic/indiantreepix/VH_yTkIuR50/unsubscribe. >> To unsubscribe from this group and all its topics, send an email to >> [email protected]. >> To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. >> >> Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/indiantreepix. >> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >> > > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "efloraofindia" group. 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