There is something to be said for user-specific training. I remember a course we took some years ago, teaching us how to use our current MMIS system. This is a complex, multi-layer, multi-option system, and the instructor was Hell-bent that we were going to learn it all in one day—whether we needed it or not. I subsequently learned that the interface was pretty consistent across all the tasks, so, if yu learn one, you can learn many, but this shotgun approach slowed down the training a good bit. The trainer was oblivious to what we said we needed. Perhaps a middle approach is called for. A good trainer will probably know how to assess various clients and situations. \ Ted
From: Adrian Spratt [mailto:[email protected]] Sent: Thursday, December 31, 2015 2:43 PM To: [email protected] Subject: Re: Are there any NVDA (or WindowEyes) and JAWS "dual users" or people who've used both here? Brian, I agree, it’s essential that JAWS users know about the right-mouse click option. Usually, the choices that come up in that menu are identical to those you obtain by pressing the applications key, but not always. Once in a while, the right-mouse click menu provides the only solution to an accessibility problem. Separately, I have done some informal JAWS training, and I partially disagree with the idea that a trainer should focus only on those issues a client wants resolved. Even if a client lists a set of tasks they would like to learn, it’s still important to establish a degree of JAWS familiarity. Once established, you can build from that foundation so that the client learns not only the keystrokes for a specific task, but also how to solve similar problems as they arise going forward. It’s the old saying that goes something like you can give someone a fish or you can teach them how to fish. I haven’t followed these threads in any detail, but I notice your seeming perplexity about forms mode. I take it you understand that this is a JAWS device to solve the problem that JAWS users can’t just land on an edit field and type. Forms mode enables the user to make it possible to type when you land on an edit field. Finally, while it’s no doubt useful to be able to see a screen to see why certain JAWS problems might be occurring, I would think it’s essential for a trainer to learn to listen to JAWS as it performs. Just some thoughts. From: Brian Vogel [mailto:[email protected]]<mailto:[mailto:[email protected]]> Sent: Thursday, December 31, 2015 1:12 PM To: [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]> Subject: Re: Are there any NVDA (or WindowEyes) and JAWS "dual users" or people who've used both here? Kevin, Thanks for your input. I just want to hasten to add that my motivation for "forcing" the occasional use of the mouse buttons is not, in any way, because I think that any given method is the "right" one, but sometimes there really is a "best" one. A number of my clients have expressed utter amazement when I teach them about the presence of the context menu that pops up anywhere (pretty much) when you right click on anything that can be operated on in some way and that this menu restricts you to the actual things you can do to that actual object. It saves so much menu arrow-through time (and I'm amazed how many of my clients cling to using arrow-through even after they know the "you can type the first letter of the function you're searching for to speed your way down the menu" technique). It also avoids, almost entirely, the presence of stippled-out options that cannot be selected at the moment because they do not fit the actual context of the moment, but must be in a general-purpose full menu anyway. All of the above having been said, if anyone detects what they feel is even the slightest whiff of condescension or trying to "force blind people to do something the sighted way" in my posts or descriptions of how I tutor, please let me know about this directly, but kindly. That is absolutely never my intention, but unintentional paternalism, rudeness, or slights are as bad or worse than intentional ones. Just realize that any of these are occurring out of ignorance, not malice. Brian
