On 4 Mar 2018, at 20:07, Jon Evans <j...@craftyjon.com
<mailto:j...@craftyjon.com>> wrote:
We should probably make some kind of road map if it doesn't exist
already, concerning the path to GAL for eeschema and who will be
doing what. For example, it might make sense to do the SCHEMATIC
class refactoring you were talking about before or in parallel
with parts of the porting effort.
I'm up for working on this too, as soon as my connectivity / bus
stuff has landed.
-Jon
On Sun, Mar 4, 2018, 14:46 Wayne Stambaugh <stambau...@gmail.com
<mailto:stambau...@gmail.com>> wrote:
I agree. If it's not an easy straight forward fix, I would
prefer to
spend our precious manpower resources on the GAL port as
well. I don't
know when in the v6 cycle any of this will happen but I'm
guessing it
will happen fairly early. Tom or Orson, do either of you
have any idea
when this will happen?
Wayne
On 03/04/2018 02:40 PM, Jon Evans wrote:
> FWIW, I don't find the existing performance to be unusable,
it's just
> not up to the standards of PcbNew/GAL. I don't think it's
worth any
> effort beyond easy fixes, we should put that energy into
the GAL port.
>
> -Jon
>
> On Sun, Mar 4, 2018, 14:34 Bernhard Stegmaier
<stegma...@sw-systems.de <mailto:stegma...@sw-systems.de>
> <mailto:stegma...@sw-systems.de
<mailto:stegma...@sw-systems.de>>> wrote:
>
> I would judge it wrt eeschema GAL conversion.
> If that starts with v6, I don’t know if it is worth the
effort.
> If it is unsure when this will happen, it might be
worth it.
>
>
>> On 4. Mar 2018, at 20:30, Wayne Stambaugh
<stambau...@gmail.com <mailto:stambau...@gmail.com>
>> <mailto:stambau...@gmail.com
<mailto:stambau...@gmail.com>>> wrote:
>>
>> Ughh! I don't have a good answer for this one. My
best guess is
>> to fix
>> the wx macos code first and see what performance
issues are left. The
>> problem with messing with any of this is that if you break
>> something it
>> will break all of the legacy canvas rendering not just
the schematic
>> editor. I would move extremely carefully here. I
would prefer
>> that we
>> don't go too crazy this late in the v5 release cycle.
If the
>> performance is truly not usable on macos, then we may
have no choice.
>>
>> On 03/04/2018 02:07 PM, Jeff Young wrote:
>>> It turns out the fonts aren’t really the problem.
>>>
>>> It starts with this gem in wxWidgets:
>>>
>>>
voidwxWidgetCocoaImpl::ScrollRect(constwxRect*rect,intdx,intdy)
>>>
>>> {
>>>
>>> #if1
>>>
>>> SetNeedsDisplay();
>>>
>>> #else
>>>
>>>
//Weshoulddosomethinglikethis,butitwasn'tworkingin10.4.
>>>
>>> if(GetNeedsDisplay())
>>>
>>> {
>>>
>>> SetNeedsDisplay() ;
>>>
>>> }
>>>
>>> NSRectr=wxToNSRect([m_osxViewsuperview],*rect);
>>>
>>> NSSizeoffset=NSMakeSize((float)dx,(float)dy);
>>>
>>> [m_osxViewscrollRect:rby:offset];
>>>
>>> #endif
>>>
>>> }
>>>
>>>
>>> SetNeedsDisplay() with no rectangle argument
invalidates the
>>> entire window.
>>>
>>> Even if you fix that (to scroll most of the window
and only
>>> invalidate
>>> the newly-exposed parts), you run into this:
>>>
>>>
voidwxWidgetCocoaImpl::drawRect(void*rect,WXWidgetslf,void*WXUNUSED(_cmd))
>>>
>>> {
>>>
>>> //preparingtheupdateregion
>>>
>>> wxRegionupdateRgn;
>>>
>>>
>>>
//sinceaddingmanyrectstoaregionisacostlyprocess,bydefaultusetheboundingrect
>>>
>>> #if0
>>>
>>> constNSRect*rects;
>>>
>>> NSIntegercount;
>>>
>>> [slfgetRectsBeingDrawn:&rectscount:&count];
>>>
>>> for(inti=0;i<count;++i)
>>>
>>> {
>>>
>>> updateRgn.Union(wxFromNSRect(slf,rects[i]));
>>>
>>> }
>>>
>>> #else
>>>
>>> updateRgn.Union(wxFromNSRect(slf,*(NSRect*)rect));
>>>
>>> #endif
>>>
>>>
>>> …which will /also/ cause the whole window to be
repainted if there’s
>>> both an invalidated horizontal strip and a vertical one.
>>>
>>> And the latter turns out to be pretty much guaranteed
by this
>>> one, which
>>> batches repaints:
>>>
>>> voidwxNonOwnedWindow::Update()
>>>
>>> {
>>>
>>> if(clock()-s_lastFlush>CLOCKS_PER_SEC/30)
>>>
>>> {
>>>
>>> s_lastFlush=clock();
>>>
>>> m_nowpeer->Update();
>>>
>>> }
>>>
>>> }
>>>
>>>
>>> But even Kicad isn’t blameless. Once you fix all
those there’s
>>> still no
>>> checking in SCH_SCREEN::Draw() to see if the
individual draw items
>>> intersect the update region. (Sure, the actually
drawing is
>>> clipped in
>>> the end, but you still go through a /lot/ of code to
get there.)
>>>
>>> All of these are fixable, and we’ve already crossed
the Rubicon of
>>> having our own OSX wxWidgets branch.
>>>
>>> But it’s still a reasonable amount of work, with a
non-trivial risk
>>> profile. Should I continue?
>>>
>>> Cheers,
>>> Jeff.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>> On 4 Mar 2018, at 01:30, Bernhard Stegmaier
>>>> <stegma...@sw-systems.de
<mailto:stegma...@sw-systems.de>
<mailto:stegma...@sw-systems.de <mailto:stegma...@sw-systems.de>>
>>>> <mailto:stegma...@sw-systems.de
<mailto:stegma...@sw-systems.de>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> No.
>>>>
>>>>> On 4. Mar 2018, at 01:51, Andrey Kuznetsov
<kandre...@gmail.com <mailto:kandre...@gmail.com>
>>>>> <mailto:kandre...@gmail.com
<mailto:kandre...@gmail.com>>
>>>>> <mailto:kandre...@gmail.com
<mailto:kandre...@gmail.com>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> Would it be an easy fix to change the text/font
such that it
>>>>> does not
>>>>> affect performance so significantly on MacOS?
>>>>>
>>>>> On Sat, Mar 3, 2018 at 5:20 AM, Wayne Stambaugh
>>>>> <stambau...@gmail.com <mailto:stambau...@gmail.com>
<mailto:stambau...@gmail.com <mailto:stambau...@gmail.com>>
>>>>> <mailto:stambau...@gmail.com
<mailto:stambau...@gmail.com>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> On 03/03/2018 07:33 AM, Jeff Young wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> Hi Andrey,
>>>>>
>>>>> I did some profiling and I’d guess that the
difference in
>>>>> eeschema and pcbnew-legacy performance is
down to there
>>>>> being
>>>>> more text in the schema. Since we use a
stroke font,
>>>>> there’s
>>>>> a lot of stroke segments in each letter.
>>>>>
>>>>> @Devs,
>>>>>
>>>>> I understand why we use a stroke font on the
PCB, but
>>>>> there’s
>>>>> not much reason in eeschema, is there?
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> This is possibly one of the things that I plan
on changing after
>>>>> the new schematic file format is written. The
new file format
>>>>> will support font definitions so replacing the
stroke font in
>>>>> Eeschema should be doable. Whether or not I have
time to make
>>>>> this change remains to be seen.
>>>>>
>>>>> Wayne
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Cheers,
>>>>> Jeff.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On 3 Mar 2018, at 08:18, Andrey Kuznetsov
>>>>> <kandre...@gmail.com
<mailto:kandre...@gmail.com>
>>>>> <mailto:kandre...@gmail.com
<mailto:kandre...@gmail.com>> <mailto:kandre...@gmail.com
<mailto:kandre...@gmail.com>>
>>>>> <mailto:kandre...@gmail.com
<mailto:kandre...@gmail.com>
>>>>> <mailto:kandre...@gmail.com
<mailto:kandre...@gmail.com>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> The motherboard project is not very
complex, I would say
>>>>> that performance should be tolerable UP
to that size
>>>>> complexity, if we set the bar any lower,
usability will
>>>>> suffer and people won't like KiCad
because it's sluggish
>>>>> and interface lag is the worst kind of lag.
>>>>> My project isn't finished and Chris'
project is
>>>>> available
>>>>> now, is just the right complexity and
has layout
>>>>> that can
>>>>> be used for testing as well as a schematic.
>>>>>
>>>>> *LG 5K 27" display running 3200x1800
(the highest
>>>>> resolution without making text blurry,
using this for
>>>>> work every day, so it's extravagant,
it's practical)*
>>>>>
>>>>> *Actions:* pan with middle mouse, zoom
back and forth.
>>>>>
>>>>> *eeschema:*
>>>>> Low Res - at least 2 times slower than
would be
>>>>> considered normal, I would have to guess
~400ms lag
>>>>> Normal - 4-5x slower compared to low res
mode
>>>>> ~1700ms lag
>>>>> Even in low res mode, and removing 75%
of the items from
>>>>> Chris' schematic, the lag is still
~200-300ms, that's
>>>>> just not right. Additionally, I filed
>>>>> https://bugs.launchpad.net/kicad/+bug/1753054
<https://bugs.launchpad.net/kicad/+bug/1753054>
>>>>>
<https://bugs.launchpad.net/kicad/+bug/1753054
<https://bugs.launchpad.net/kicad/+bug/1753054>> because
>>>>> the mouse zoom is screwed up in
eeschema, coupled with
>>>>> the lag, it's unusable. Maybe the pan
lag is related to
>>>>> the zoom, maybe there are multiple steps
being rendered
>>>>> when it should just jump to where the
mouse ended up at,
>>>>> I don't know.
>>>>>
>>>>> *pcbnew - **Normal Resolution:*
>>>>> Accelerated: No-AA, <50ms
>>>>> Fallback: 500-1000ms for panning,
300-600ms for zoom
>>>>> Legacy: 1300-1700ms for panning, 600ms
for zoom
>>>>> Low Res mode: did not notice speed
increase, except
>>>>> maybe
>>>>> Fallback was ~400ms faster.
>>>>>
>>>>> I'm not saying halt the horses, certain
modes are
>>>>> obviously limited, ie Legacy and
Fallback by the nature
>>>>> of the task presented, but eeschema is
barely displaying
>>>>> 10% of the content pcbnew is but lagging
so much worse!
>>>>>
>>>>> Just thought I'd include rendering of
the Accelerated
>>>>> Graphics (top to bottom: Supersampling
4x, Subpixel AA
>>>>> (Ultra Quality), No AA)
>>>>> All 3 modes are responsive, probably
<50-100ms lag, I'd
>>>>> consider this performance great,
considering the amount
>>>>> of elements on screen.
>>>>> <image.png>
>>>>>
>>>>> How long should it take to delete this
many selected
>>>>> elements in pcbnew?
>>>>> Answer: about 50x too long! I think it
was like 3mins,
>>>>> perhaps ESC key should be available to
press anytime to
>>>>> undo the delete action and restore to
pre-delete screen
>>>>> when accidental actions are triggered
that take forever
>>>>> to complete?
>>>>> <image.png>
>>>>>
>>>>> On Fri, Mar 2, 2018 at 9:53 AM, Bernhard
Stegmaier
>>>>> <stegma...@sw-systems.de
<mailto:stegma...@sw-systems.de>
>>>>> <mailto:stegma...@sw-systems.de
<mailto:stegma...@sw-systems.de>> <mailto:stegma...@sw-systems.de
<mailto:stegma...@sw-systems.de>>
>>>>> <mailto:stegma...@sw-systems.de
<mailto:stegma...@sw-systems.de>
>>>>> <mailto:stegma...@sw-systems.de
<mailto:stegma...@sw-systems.de>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> Hi,
>>>>>
>>>>> to be honest, I don’t really know
what this is
>>>>> about.
>>>>>
>>>>> @Andrey:
>>>>> You looked for a very complex
(foreign) project
>>>>> (Chris mainboard?)
>>>>> to prove that eeschema is slow on Mac?
>>>>> Well, we know that and we told you
already some
>>>>> weeks/months ago
>>>>> why it is like it is (if memory
serves me right).
>>>>>
>>>>> Or, do you have an own project that
is so
>>>>> ridiculously slow, that
>>>>> you can’t work with it?
>>>>> If so, please provide it so that we
can analyse why
>>>>> this specific
>>>>> project behaves like that.
>>>>> If you can’t or don’t want to
provide it we could
>>>>> tell you how to
>>>>> do some performance measurements so
that we
>>>>> might see
>>>>> something.
>>>>>
>>>>> Obviously, there are a number of Mac
users here and
>>>>> also over at
>>>>> the KiCad forum who might also be
happy to get
>>>>> some more
>>>>> performance here and there, but who
are in general
>>>>> reasonably able
>>>>> to work on their projects (including
myself, on a
>>>>> 2012 Retina
>>>>> MacBook with only an i5).
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Regards,
>>>>> Bernhard
>>>>>
>>>>> > On 2. Mar 2018, at 17:59, Andy Peters
>>>>> <de...@latke.net <mailto:de...@latke.net>
>>>>> <mailto:de...@latke.net
<mailto:de...@latke.net>> <mailto:de...@latke.net
<mailto:de...@latke.net>>
>>>>>
>>>>> <mailto:de...@latke.net
<mailto:de...@latke.net> <mailto:de...@latke.net
<mailto:de...@latke.net>>>> wrote:
>>>>> >
>>>>> >
>>>>> >
>>>>> >> On Mar 1, 2018, at 8:53 PM, Seth
Hillbrand
>>>>> <seth.hillbr...@gmail.com
<mailto:seth.hillbr...@gmail.com>
>>>>> <mailto:seth.hillbr...@gmail.com
<mailto:seth.hillbr...@gmail.com>>
>>>>> <mailto:seth.hillbr...@gmail.com
<mailto:seth.hillbr...@gmail.com>>
>>>>> <mailto:seth.hillbr...@gmail.com
<mailto:seth.hillbr...@gmail.com>
>>>>> <mailto:seth.hillbr...@gmail.com
<mailto:seth.hillbr...@gmail.com>>>> wrote:
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >> Andrey-
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >> I'm moving this to a new thread
so that we don't
>>>>> conflate the
>>>>> OpenMP discussion with this.
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >> Can you test running Kicad with
the "Open in Low
>>>>> Resolution"
>>>>> mode enabled? You can activate this
by choosing
>>>>> "Get
>>>>> Info" on the
>>>>> main KiCad application and checking
the option that
>>>>> says "Open in
>>>>> Low Resolution". You may need to do
the same
>>>>> for the
>>>>> other
>>>>> applications (Eeschema, pcbnew, etc)
as well.
>>>>> >
>>>>> > testing on my 2017” touch-bar MBP …
>>>>> >
>>>>> > Good g-d, low-res mode looks fuzzy
and weird!
>>>>> >
>>>>> > I don’t notice any specific
differences in
>>>>> EESchema
>>>>> performance.
>>>>> Maybe my schematic isn’t busy
enough? I’m a fan of
>>>>> using more
>>>>> smaller sheets with less info on
each than one big
>>>>> sheet with
>>>>> everything.
>>>>> >
>>>>> > I know, anecdote is not evidence.
>>>>> >
>>>>> > -a
>>>>> >
>>>>> >
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >> -Seth
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >> 2018-03-01 18:09 GMT-08:00
Andrey Kuznetsov
>>>>> <kandre...@gmail.com
<mailto:kandre...@gmail.com>
>>>>> <mailto:kandre...@gmail.com
<mailto:kandre...@gmail.com>> <mailto:kandre...@gmail.com
<mailto:kandre...@gmail.com>>
>>>>> <mailto:kandre...@gmail.com
<mailto:kandre...@gmail.com> <mailto:kandre...@gmail.com
<mailto:kandre...@gmail.com>>>>:
>>>>> >> Hi,
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >> So for now I've had a chance to
test the
>>>>> motherboard project on
>>>>> my Retina macbook display.
>>>>> >> eeschema: horrible zoom, feels
like elastic band
>>>>> zoom and I
>>>>> have all scroll wheel accelerations
and similar
>>>>> disabled, zoom
>>>>> response is super laggy, cannot work
like this, will
>>>>> need to make
>>>>> schematics on windows.
>>>>> >> pcbnew by order of slowness:
>>>>> >> legacy - pretty slow, zoom lag is
major, boo boo
>>>>> >> modern (fallback) - decent, but
the lag can be
>>>>> felt, zoom lag
>>>>> is minor
>>>>> >> modern (accelerated) - almost
cannot feel the
>>>>> lag,
>>>>> very nice,
>>>>> nice zoom responsiveness
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >> I'll report tomorrow on 5K LG
display.
>>>>> >>
>>>>> >
>>>>> >
>>>>> >
_______________________________________________
>>>>> > Mailing list:
>>>>> https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers
<https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers>
>>>>> <https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers
<https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers>>
>>>>>
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<https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers>
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_______________________________________________
>>>>> Mailing
>>>>> list: https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers
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>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>> Remember The Past, Live The Present,
Change The Future
>>>>> Those who look only to the past or the
present are
>>>>> certain to miss the future [JFK]
>>>>>
>>>>> kandre...@gmail.com <mailto:kandre...@gmail.com>
>>>>> <mailto:kandre...@gmail.com
<mailto:kandre...@gmail.com>> <mailto:kandre...@gmail.com
<mailto:kandre...@gmail.com>>
>>>>> <mailto:kandre...@gmail.com
<mailto:kandre...@gmail.com> <mailto:kandre...@gmail.com
<mailto:kandre...@gmail.com>>>
>>>>> Live Long and Prosper,
>>>>> Andrey
>>>>>
_______________________________________________
>>>>> Mailing list:
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>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>> Remember The Past, Live The Present, Change The Future
>>>>> Those who look only to the past or the present are
certain to miss
>>>>> the future [JFK]
>>>>>
>>>>> kandre...@gmail.com <mailto:kandre...@gmail.com>
>>>>> <mailto:kandre...@gmail.com
<mailto:kandre...@gmail.com>> <mailto:kandre...@gmail.com
<mailto:kandre...@gmail.com>>
>>>>> Live Long and Prosper,
>>>>> Andrey
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> Mailing list:
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<https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers>
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