https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=71534
--- Comment #12 from Charles <[email protected]> --- Thanks for the thoughtful response. Ok, I'm convinced that just letting someone upload a document with a comment 'it is broken, open it to see' would not be a good thing to do. Also, the question of requiring them to register or not was just not a real part of this Feature Request, although it may have come across that way. If you want to require it, fine, but make it a simple part of the document submission process - ie, when they initially submit the document, by providing their email address (be sure to explain this clearly of course), they are actually registering with the system. However (see below)... (In reply to comment #5) > I pretty much completely agree with Owen here. The lower we set the > bar the more users will do what people tend to do which is "the least > bit possible" So add some prompts for additional/minimal info as I suggested/described, ie: 'Where does the problem reside? choices: Header, Footer, Body (specific choices depending on the document type of course) Then some few follow ups - ie: 'What page(s) exhibit(s) the problem? Drill down with these kinds of simple prompts as much as you like, but I honestly don't see that much drilling down would be needed. The main point I'm trying to make here is that requiring people (and please understand, by 'people' I mean 'ordinary' people - ie, NON-programmers, and people who may think a 'bug tracker' is someone trained in finding out where the ants are coming from) to go through the current Bug Tracker to report a bug for simple document formatting issues is raising the bar so high that I guarantee you at least an order of magnitude more people simply give up, than actually jump through all the hoops to successfully report a problem. What this Feature Request is about is a new, simple and *separate* *interface* to the *existing* bug system, intended only for reporting compatibility issues with Microsoft Office file formats. And this same interface should be used when interacting with these specific bug types (ie, if a reporter is asked for more info, when they get the email and click the link, it takes them to the *simplified* interface as opposed to the main bug tracking system). The whole idea is to keep things as simple as possible for people who are not technically inclined, but who interact with a lot of people who use Microsoft Documents. > this is why I routinely puts bugs in NEEDINFO even if perhaps if I > took a bit more time I could understand it - the reason being is that > in the past this philosophy was taken and basically bug reports > continued to get worse and worse. "Open this document and see the > problem" when the problem is 10 pages long with text and other things > going on - you say "it only takes a minutes" but let's say a bad > report takes 3-5 minutes to triage (which isn't terrible) but a good > report of the same problem takes 30 seconds That is precisely the problem this Feature Request is meant to resolve - getting good/better bug reports - but at the same time, to get *more* *of* *them*, by making it *easy* for people to make *good* bug reports. And again, I'm only talking about document formatting/compatibility issues. > when we're talking about thousands of bugs, really it's the least a > bug reporter can do is make it "as easy and clear as possible" so as > not to disrespect QA's time - time is money, and mine is surely > stretched thin right now. The vast majority of bugs are extremely complex and have nothing (or little) to do with ODF<>MSO file formatting issues. > As for registering - we've already seen trolls even with > registration and some people have been banned because of it. A much > better solution is to get openID working so they don't have to have > so many accounts - and this is currently being looked into. Yeah, and then you still have the problems of people who will never use OpenID, or who wouldn't know hot to use it if they wanted to. > Again, the lower we set the bar the more work is puts on the > shoulders of a very small team and that simply isn't fair. Again - I'm talking about *lightening* the load. With an enhanced, simple reporting interface like what I'm talking about, you could get a lot more people who are interested in this particular aspect to do the initial triaging, thus *freeing* *up* developers time. > FLOSS is a community, if individuals don't want to be part of that > community, there are plenty of other products out there that they can > choose from or, they can sit patiently and wait for fixes (instead of > giving a terrible report, getting irritated when the report goes into > NEEDINFO and then every couple months saying things like "any > progress" "why isn't this fixed yet" "can we expect a fix soon", > either be a member of the community or don't, else, you're trying to > take from the community and give nothing in return. > > In general though I don't see this being a problem at all - I very > rarely see users angry about having to register and usually if I put > a bug into NEEDINFO the user apologizes for lack of clarity and gives > precise steps. Yes - but for every user who actually knows how to work in bug trackers, or those who don't, but take the time to figure out how to register and actually report a bug, how many who eagerly tried to find out how to report a problem with one of the documents sent to them by someone else turned away in utter frustration and disgust at the convoluted, complicated process that is this bug tracker? I would wager it is a very large multiple of the number of users who successfully report a bug to the satisfaction of the developers triaging them. Anyway, this is just my point of view... and the reason I'm so interested in it is because our company recently went on a Microsoft Office buying binge because of the myriad of document compatibility problems with Microsoft's new XML file formats... -- You are receiving this mail because: You are the assignee for the bug.
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