Linux-Advocacy Digest #220, Volume #29 Tue, 19 Sep 00 23:13:05 EDT
Contents:
Re: [OT] Global warming. (was Public v. Private Schools) (Jason Bowen)
Re: [OT] Public v. Private Schools ("Aaron R. Kulkis")
Re: [OT] Global warming. (was Public v. Private Schools) ("Aaron R. Kulkis")
Re: The internet was built on WIndow 95? (was Re: How low can they go...?) ("Erik
Funkenbusch")
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: Jason Bowen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To:
comp.os.os2.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: [OT] Global warming. (was Public v. Private Schools)
Date: Tue, 19 Sep 2000 20:29:13 -0600
"Aaron R. Kulkis" wrote:
>
> WickedDyno wrote:
> >
> > In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, "Aaron R. Kulkis"
> > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >
> > > "Joseph T. Adams" wrote:
> > > >
> > > > In comp.os.linux.advocacy Chad Myers <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > > > wrote in part:
> > > >
> > > > : The Earth is a system of balances. If one thing gets out of whack,
> > > > : 10 other things compensate to restore the balance.
> > > >
> > > > This is true of market economies also.
> > > >
> > > > The problem is that it can take a really long time (from our
> > > > perspective at least) for the damage to be corrected.
> > > >
> > > > : This has been happening over billions of years. Many more catastrophic
> > > > : things have happened to the ecosystem that Humans could ever cook up
> > > > : and the ecosystem restored itself in a geological second. The amount
> > > > : of data we, as humans, have collected scientifically over the past
> > > > : 1-200 years is nothing. It's not even a nano-second in geological
> > > > : terms. To conclude or attempt to draw anything from these statistics
> > > > : is meaningless and absurd to say the least.
> > > >
> > > > We've collected substantial evidence of the earth's geological
> > > > history.
> > > >
> > > > The catastrophes of earlier geological ages did not destroy the earth,
> > > > nor will our activities, but they *did* change the climate in ways
> > > > that would have been horribly destructive to human civilization had it
> > > > existed at the time. The fear is that our far smaller, but still
> > > > potentially significant, activities might similarly cause destruction
> > > > to human (and other) habitats in the relatively near future.
> > > >
> > > > I'm not convinced that it will. I'm convinced that it might, though,
> > > > and that the chance that it might is sufficient reason for us to
> > > > continue to study and to evaluate our activities to make sure that we
> > > > aren't creating any potentially avoidable problems.
> > > >
> > > > : Dinosaur populations excreted more methane and CO/2 than humans
> > > > : could ever hope to generate.
> > > >
> > > > Yep. But most of the sites of today's cities were under water then.
> > > > Later, most of today's lakes and straits and mountains were under
> > > > thousands of feet of ice. Neither of those outcomes would be
> > > > particularly desirable today.
> > > >
> > > > : It's rather arrogant and self-important
> > > > : to think that humans are so powerful that we could permanently change
> > > > : or destroy the ecosystem and have it stay permanently dead.
> > > >
> > > > I don't think anyone is alleging that we could permanently destroy the
> > > > Earth. Only that our activities, if continued unchecked, could alter
> > > > climate substantially enough, and for long enough, to have a
> > > > detrimental impact on human and other habitats.
> > > >
> > > > : We will
> > > > : kill ourselves with war or accidentally releasing a deadly virus
> > > > : into the world before we'll ever hope to destroy this planet.
> > > >
> > > > Very possible. We've come damn close, more than once. Closer than
> > > > most people are willing to believe.
> > > >
> > > > : Granted, we shouldn't try, I agree we need to control ourselves
> > > >
> > > > That's all I'm saying. It's all that responsible environmentalists
> > > > are saying too. (There are a lot of very *irresponsible* folks
> > > > pretending to be environmentalists that are saying a lot more.
> > > > Mostly, those are folks with political agendas, usually of a leftist
> > > > variety, who *use* well-meaning but naive environmental activists to
> > > > promote that agenda.)
> > > >
> > > > , but
> > > > : this world has been through huge floods, all sorts of geological
> > > > : disasters (giant earthquakes, massive volcanoes spewing millions of
> > > > : tons of CO/2, methane, and all other sorts of noxious gasses into
> > > > : the atmosphere) and look where we are today, paradise.
> > > >
> > > > We have an environment that is in many respects better than it ever
> > > > has been (more free from infectious disease, for example).
> > > >
> > > > The challenge is keeping it that way.
> > > >
> > > > And in spite of the progress we've made, there still are serious
> > > > problems such as air pollution in large cities, both air and water
> > > > pollution behind the former Iron Curtain, rapid deforestation in
> > > > certain areas (mostly South America and Latin America), and, to be
> > > > blunt, unsustainable development in certain parts of the world where
> > > > there simply is not enough guaranteed fresh water to sustain life.
> > > > (The wealthy oil states of the Middle East, and the urban areas of the
> > > > southwestern U.S., are prime examples of this).
> > > >
> > > > Preventable diseases still kill tens of millions in the poorest
> > > > countries. Wars and famines caused mostly by statist political
> > > > ideologies claim many more.
> > > >
> > > > We're doing better than we did in the past in many ways, but there is
> > > > still much work left to be done.
> > > >
> > > > As a libertarian I hope it can be done the way it should be, namely,
> > > > by voluntary cooperation and consent.
> > > >
> > > > But it does need to be done.
> > > >
> > > > I don't know if global warming is something we can control, or should
> > > > attempt to. But I certainly would like to know. And I certainly
> > > > suggest caution in the meantime.
> > > >
> > > > : We're do for
> > > > : another ice age here in about 25-50,000 years or so, we're probably
> > > > : just seeing the cycle repeat itself and seeing the ecosystem building
> > > > : up and building up for the next ice age when it'll all start over
> > > > : again and the same thing will happen 100,000 years after that like
> > > > : it's done for the past several million years.
> > > >
> > > > Probably.
> > > >
> > > > But in the meantime I'd like those who will come after me to be able
> > > > to enjoy the same, or better, environmental AND economic conditions
> > > > that we have today.
> > > >
> > > > To ensure this, we must avoid both extremes. We must not destroy
> > > > people's livelihoods in a vain attempt to meet arbitrary or
> > > > unrealistic goals that might not be necessary or even worthwhile. At
> > > > the same time, we must not ignore the mounting evidence that warming
> > > > *is* occurring, that human activities *may* be contributing to it, and
> > > > that the costs for dealing with it *will* be staggering.
> > > >
> > > > : Humanity is not even a blink of an eye in the Earth's history and
> > > > : it's not about to be destroyed by us.
> > > >
> > > > Unlike some of my more left-leaning peers, I'm not concerned about the
> > > > destruction of Earth, so much as I am about the destruction of human
> > > > (and other) life on it.
> > > >
> > > > Joe
> > >
> > > Paging Chicken Little
> > > Paging Chicken Little
> > >
> > > The Sky is Falling!
> >
> > If someone tells me the sky is falling, I at least look up.
>
> That is why......... you fail.
>
The Catholic Church wouldn't admit Galileo was right till this century.
> --
> Aaron R. Kulkis
> Unix Systems Engineer
> ICQ # 3056642
>
> H: "Having found not one single carbon monoxide leak on the entire
> premises, it is my belief, and Willard concurs, that the reason
> you folks feel listless and disoriented is simply because
> you are lazy, stupid people"
>
> I: Loren Petrich's 2-week stubborn refusal to respond to the
> challenge to describe even one philosophical difference
> between himself and the communists demonstrates that, in fact,
> Loren Petrich is a COMMUNIST ***hole
>
> A: The wise man is mocked by fools.
>
> B: Jet Silverman plays the fool and spews out nonsense as a
> method of sidetracking discussions which are headed in a
> direction that she doesn't like.
>
> C: Jet Silverman claims to have killfiled me.
>
> D: Jet Silverman now follows me from newgroup to newsgroup
> ...despite (D) above.
>
> E: Jet is not worthy of the time to compose a response until
> their behavior improves.
>
> F: Unit_4's "Kook hunt" reminds me of "Jimmy Baker's" harangues against
> adultery while concurrently committing adultery with Tammy Hahn.
>
> G: Knackos...you're a retard.
------------------------------
From: "Aaron R. Kulkis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To:
comp.os.os2.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: [OT] Public v. Private Schools
Date: Tue, 19 Sep 2000 22:44:05 -0400
WickedDyno wrote:
>
> In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, "Aaron R. Kulkis"
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > WickedDyno wrote:
> > >
> > > In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, "Aaron R. Kulkis"
> > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > >
> > > > WickedDyno wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, "Aaron R. Kulkis"
> > > > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > > [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Bob, that sort of logic reminds me of the gun nut's arguments,
> > > > > > > you
> > > > > > > know, the
> > > > > > > fact that the US has a very high % of houshold firearm
> > > > > > > ownership ,
> > > > > > > and
> > > > > > > that
> > > > > > > it also has an extremely high death by firearm rate, but that
> > > > > > > these
> > > > > > > two
> > > > > > > statistics are not realted!!!!
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Switzerland and Isreal have even higher rates of firearm
> > > > > > ownership.
> > > > > > Not only that..but FULLY AUTOMATIC RIFLES* and yet, BOTH have
> > > > > > lower
> > > > > > rates of death by firearms.
> > > > >
> > > > > Both also require military service and so have a much larger number
> > > > > of
> > > > > people who are highly trained in gun usage and safety.
> > > >
> > > > Which should, by your argument, RAISE criminality, as they all
> > > > criminals know how to shoot straight.
> > >
> > > Umm, whose argument?
> > >
> > > It would definitely reduce the number of accidental gun deaths.
> > >
> > > > > (FWIW, I wouldn't feel unsafe living in such a society, despite the
> > > > > number of guns around. I do feel unsafe living in a society that
> > > > > has
> > > > > fewer guns but even fewer trained, disciplined gun owners.)
> > > >
> > > > So...bring back the draft.
> > >
> > > That brings other problems, at least in our society.
> > >
> > > > > > Britain recently outlawed handguns. Murder rates have tripled
> > > > > > since.
> > > > > > Australia outlawed ALL firearms. Murder rates have quintupled.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > So...quite obviously, the correlation between gun ownership and
> > > > > > murder is tenous at best.
> > > > >
> > > > > Except of course that the issue is correlation between gun
> > > > > ownership
> > > > > and
> > > > > gun-related deaths.
> > >
> > > You don't have an answer for that, do you?
> >
> > There is no correlation between gun ownership and murder rates.
>
> Did you read what I wrote? Do you deny there is a correlation between
> gun ownershi and gun-related deaths?
In many cases, it is a NEGATIVE correlation...fewer legally owned
guns INCREASES the rate of gun-related deaths.
Prof. John Lott did a 10-year study on it. "More Guns, Less Crime".
As usual, you're displaying your fucking ignorance.
You should, like, do something about that.
--
Aaron R. Kulkis
Unix Systems Engineer
ICQ # 3056642
H: "Having found not one single carbon monoxide leak on the entire
premises, it is my belief, and Willard concurs, that the reason
you folks feel listless and disoriented is simply because
you are lazy, stupid people"
I: Loren Petrich's 2-week stubborn refusal to respond to the
challenge to describe even one philosophical difference
between himself and the communists demonstrates that, in fact,
Loren Petrich is a COMMUNIST ***hole
A: The wise man is mocked by fools.
B: Jet Silverman plays the fool and spews out nonsense as a
method of sidetracking discussions which are headed in a
direction that she doesn't like.
C: Jet Silverman claims to have killfiled me.
D: Jet Silverman now follows me from newgroup to newsgroup
...despite (D) above.
E: Jet is not worthy of the time to compose a response until
their behavior improves.
F: Unit_4's "Kook hunt" reminds me of "Jimmy Baker's" harangues against
adultery while concurrently committing adultery with Tammy Hahn.
G: Knackos...you're a retard.
------------------------------
From: "Aaron R. Kulkis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To:
comp.os.os2.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: [OT] Global warming. (was Public v. Private Schools)
Date: Tue, 19 Sep 2000 22:45:16 -0400
WickedDyno wrote:
>
> In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, "Aaron R. Kulkis"
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > WickedDyno wrote:
> > >
> > > In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, "Aaron R. Kulkis"
> > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > >
> > > > "Joseph T. Adams" wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > In comp.os.linux.advocacy Chad Myers <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > > > > wrote in part:
> > > > >
> > > > > : The Earth is a system of balances. If one thing gets out of
> > > > > : whack,
> > > > > : 10 other things compensate to restore the balance.
> > > > >
> > > > > This is true of market economies also.
> > > > >
> > > > > The problem is that it can take a really long time (from our
> > > > > perspective at least) for the damage to be corrected.
> > > > >
> > > > > : This has been happening over billions of years. Many more
> > > > > : catastrophic
> > > > > : things have happened to the ecosystem that Humans could ever cook
> > > > > : up
> > > > > : and the ecosystem restored itself in a geological second. The
> > > > > : amount
> > > > > : of data we, as humans, have collected scientifically over the
> > > > > : past
> > > > > : 1-200 years is nothing. It's not even a nano-second in geological
> > > > > : terms. To conclude or attempt to draw anything from these
> > > > > : statistics
> > > > > : is meaningless and absurd to say the least.
> > > > >
> > > > > We've collected substantial evidence of the earth's geological
> > > > > history.
> > > > >
> > > > > The catastrophes of earlier geological ages did not destroy the
> > > > > earth,
> > > > > nor will our activities, but they *did* change the climate in ways
> > > > > that would have been horribly destructive to human civilization had
> > > > > it
> > > > > existed at the time. The fear is that our far smaller, but still
> > > > > potentially significant, activities might similarly cause
> > > > > destruction
> > > > > to human (and other) habitats in the relatively near future.
> > > > >
> > > > > I'm not convinced that it will. I'm convinced that it might,
> > > > > though,
> > > > > and that the chance that it might is sufficient reason for us to
> > > > > continue to study and to evaluate our activities to make sure that
> > > > > we
> > > > > aren't creating any potentially avoidable problems.
> > > > >
> > > > > : Dinosaur populations excreted more methane and CO/2 than humans
> > > > > : could ever hope to generate.
> > > > >
> > > > > Yep. But most of the sites of today's cities were under water
> > > > > then.
> > > > > Later, most of today's lakes and straits and mountains were under
> > > > > thousands of feet of ice. Neither of those outcomes would be
> > > > > particularly desirable today.
> > > > >
> > > > > : It's rather arrogant and self-important
> > > > > : to think that humans are so powerful that we could permanently
> > > > > : change
> > > > > : or destroy the ecosystem and have it stay permanently dead.
> > > > >
> > > > > I don't think anyone is alleging that we could permanently destroy
> > > > > the
> > > > > Earth. Only that our activities, if continued unchecked, could
> > > > > alter
> > > > > climate substantially enough, and for long enough, to have a
> > > > > detrimental impact on human and other habitats.
> > > > >
> > > > > : We will
> > > > > : kill ourselves with war or accidentally releasing a deadly virus
> > > > > : into the world before we'll ever hope to destroy this planet.
> > > > >
> > > > > Very possible. We've come damn close, more than once. Closer than
> > > > > most people are willing to believe.
> > > > >
> > > > > : Granted, we shouldn't try, I agree we need to control ourselves
> > > > >
> > > > > That's all I'm saying. It's all that responsible environmentalists
> > > > > are saying too. (There are a lot of very *irresponsible* folks
> > > > > pretending to be environmentalists that are saying a lot more.
> > > > > Mostly, those are folks with political agendas, usually of a
> > > > > leftist
> > > > > variety, who *use* well-meaning but naive environmental activists
> > > > > to
> > > > > promote that agenda.)
> > > > >
> > > > > , but
> > > > > : this world has been through huge floods, all sorts of geological
> > > > > : disasters (giant earthquakes, massive volcanoes spewing millions
> > > > > : of
> > > > > : tons of CO/2, methane, and all other sorts of noxious gasses into
> > > > > : the atmosphere) and look where we are today, paradise.
> > > > >
> > > > > We have an environment that is in many respects better than it ever
> > > > > has been (more free from infectious disease, for example).
> > > > >
> > > > > The challenge is keeping it that way.
> > > > >
> > > > > And in spite of the progress we've made, there still are serious
> > > > > problems such as air pollution in large cities, both air and water
> > > > > pollution behind the former Iron Curtain, rapid deforestation in
> > > > > certain areas (mostly South America and Latin America), and, to be
> > > > > blunt, unsustainable development in certain parts of the world
> > > > > where
> > > > > there simply is not enough guaranteed fresh water to sustain life.
> > > > > (The wealthy oil states of the Middle East, and the urban areas of
> > > > > the
> > > > > southwestern U.S., are prime examples of this).
> > > > >
> > > > > Preventable diseases still kill tens of millions in the poorest
> > > > > countries. Wars and famines caused mostly by statist political
> > > > > ideologies claim many more.
> > > > >
> > > > > We're doing better than we did in the past in many ways, but there
> > > > > is
> > > > > still much work left to be done.
> > > > >
> > > > > As a libertarian I hope it can be done the way it should be,
> > > > > namely,
> > > > > by voluntary cooperation and consent.
> > > > >
> > > > > But it does need to be done.
> > > > >
> > > > > I don't know if global warming is something we can control, or
> > > > > should
> > > > > attempt to. But I certainly would like to know. And I certainly
> > > > > suggest caution in the meantime.
> > > > >
> > > > > : We're do for
> > > > > : another ice age here in about 25-50,000 years or so, we're
> > > > > : probably
> > > > > : just seeing the cycle repeat itself and seeing the ecosystem
> > > > > : building
> > > > > : up and building up for the next ice age when it'll all start over
> > > > > : again and the same thing will happen 100,000 years after that
> > > > > : like
> > > > > : it's done for the past several million years.
> > > > >
> > > > > Probably.
> > > > >
> > > > > But in the meantime I'd like those who will come after me to be
> > > > > able
> > > > > to enjoy the same, or better, environmental AND economic conditions
> > > > > that we have today.
> > > > >
> > > > > To ensure this, we must avoid both extremes. We must not destroy
> > > > > people's livelihoods in a vain attempt to meet arbitrary or
> > > > > unrealistic goals that might not be necessary or even worthwhile.
> > > > > At
> > > > > the same time, we must not ignore the mounting evidence that
> > > > > warming
> > > > > *is* occurring, that human activities *may* be contributing to it,
> > > > > and
> > > > > that the costs for dealing with it *will* be staggering.
> > > > >
> > > > > : Humanity is not even a blink of an eye in the Earth's history and
> > > > > : it's not about to be destroyed by us.
> > > > >
> > > > > Unlike some of my more left-leaning peers, I'm not concerned about
> > > > > the
> > > > > destruction of Earth, so much as I am about the destruction of
> > > > > human
> > > > > (and other) life on it.
> > > > >
> > > > > Joe
> > > >
> > > > Paging Chicken Little
> > > > Paging Chicken Little
> > > >
> > > > The Sky is Falling!
> > >
> > > If someone tells me the sky is falling, I at least look up.
> >
> > That is why......... you fail.
>
> Is this the portion of the evening when we randomly quote Star Wars?
No...this is the portion of the evening when you disregard wise
analysis of why you are a loser.
--
Aaron R. Kulkis
Unix Systems Engineer
ICQ # 3056642
H: "Having found not one single carbon monoxide leak on the entire
premises, it is my belief, and Willard concurs, that the reason
you folks feel listless and disoriented is simply because
you are lazy, stupid people"
I: Loren Petrich's 2-week stubborn refusal to respond to the
challenge to describe even one philosophical difference
between himself and the communists demonstrates that, in fact,
Loren Petrich is a COMMUNIST ***hole
A: The wise man is mocked by fools.
B: Jet Silverman plays the fool and spews out nonsense as a
method of sidetracking discussions which are headed in a
direction that she doesn't like.
C: Jet Silverman claims to have killfiled me.
D: Jet Silverman now follows me from newgroup to newsgroup
...despite (D) above.
E: Jet is not worthy of the time to compose a response until
their behavior improves.
F: Unit_4's "Kook hunt" reminds me of "Jimmy Baker's" harangues against
adultery while concurrently committing adultery with Tammy Hahn.
G: Knackos...you're a retard.
------------------------------
From: "Erik Funkenbusch" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To:
comp.lang.java.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.advocacy,comp.os.ms-windows.nt.advocacy
Subject: Re: The internet was built on WIndow 95? (was Re: How low can they go...?)
Date: Tue, 19 Sep 2000 22:11:01 -0500
"R.E.Ballard ( Rex Ballard )" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:8q8va4$ud6$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> > > And what happened the first time you plugged
> > > in the PCMCIA card? Nothing,
> > >right? You had to manually install the driver for it, correct?
>
> Actually, if you are installing a laptop, you only have to indicate
> that you are enabling PCMCIA. The rest comes up automatically.
>
> Again, unless you are extremely cramped for hard drive space, there is
> very little problem with loading all the modules and letting the OS
> configure itself "on the fly".
You're assuming that the driver comes with the distribution. That won't
always be the case. Part of the PnP spec is that when devices are swapped
in, and no device driver is present, it prompts to install drivers.
Suppose that in some not too distant future, Linux becomes ubiquitious
enough that most vendors start shipping Linux drivers with new products.
What happens when you plug a device released this week into your year old
installation of Linux? Nothing.
> Linux drivers tend to be fairly generic. Essentially, the driver
> software is focused on a chip, rather than a card. The card
> identification is mapped to the appropriate chip, what is left is which
> interrupts and I/O ports can be used with that chip. Most of this can be
> configured with Linuxconf, and in some cases, switching cards simply
> means a different ID, but the same interrupts and I/O can be used.
That's not PnP.
------------------------------
** FOR YOUR REFERENCE **
The service address, to which questions about the list itself and requests
to be added to or deleted from it should be directed, is:
Internet: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
You can send mail to the entire list (and comp.os.linux.advocacy) via:
Internet: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Linux may be obtained via one of these FTP sites:
ftp.funet.fi pub/Linux
tsx-11.mit.edu pub/linux
sunsite.unc.edu pub/Linux
End of Linux-Advocacy Digest
******************************
