Linux-Misc Digest #677, Volume #21 Sun, 5 Sep 99 08:13:08 EDT
Contents:
Re: Amiga, QNX, Linux and Revolution (Guy Macon)
Re: Amiga, QNX, Linux and Revolution (Guy Macon)
anyone know how to make system.map? (John Grant)
Re: Instant messaging inside a network ("A.PADMANARAYANAN")
pppd-2.3.7 with kernel-2.2.10 problem (AGX)
Re: Wrong time setup? (Villy Kruse)
Mandrake Install Problem: No such file or directory ("SteveNews")
Re: anyone know how to make system.map? (Hans Wolters)
chat script with ISP menu selection problem ("Boon Yeo")
Re: General Rant from a Linux Newbie (Steve Gage)
Re: Netscape color (Steve Gage)
Re: *nix vs. MS security (Anthony Valentine)
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Guy Macon)
Crossposted-To: comp.os.qnx,comp.sys.amiga.misc,comp.realtime
Subject: Re: Amiga, QNX, Linux and Revolution
Date: 05 Sep 1999 02:42:38 PDT
In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Kai
Henningsen) wrote:
>So what do you get there that you don't get in Linux?
Linux: Lots of things don't bring down the OS when they crash.
Some things (like drivers) do.
QNX: More things don't bring down the OS when they crash.
>I've seen Linux boxes where the disk interface was crashed. Everything
>that didn't use the disk still worked - wasn't all that much, of course.
In QNX, you can have your disk interface crash and reconfigure everything
to run off another disk on another QNX box through the network connection,
all without even a tiny glitch to any apps that don't need a disk. Robots,
avionics, or medical devices are good examples of critical apps that
usually can run without a disk. QNX itself runs fine with no disk.
>Hell, I've seen a Linux box that was just about completely dead but still
>routing packets just fine - nothing else worked.
With QNX, you would have been able to reboot all of the dead parts,
upgrading them to the latest version if needed, all without missing
a single packet.
>I'm not saying QNX is bad. But I really don't see how *it's architecture*
>makes much of a difference with crash protection.
Here is an example. You set up a Linux system and you have a program
with a bad pointer in one of the drivers. You don't notice the pointer
error because it just happens to overwrite a non-critical memory location.
Now you change a bunch of the other drivers. Boom! your bad driver now
overwrites something critical.
Now try the same thing with QNX. That driver will always overwrite
the same non-critical memory location. In fact, that driver will
always occupy the exact same logical memory locations even if other
drivers are changed and a new kernal is installed. Only the MMU
will know that physical memory locations have changed. The driver
doesn't know this. The result of all of this is that the driver
usually either crashes right away or never crashes.
Another advantage: Exept for the rare kernel updates, everyone
runs the exact same QNX microkernel; every byte and address
location is the same. Nothing gets compiled into the kernel.
There aren't seperate kernels for different situations. Nothing
else runs at the level of the kernel or in the kernel's address
space.
Also, the QNX microkernel is very, very, small. We all know how
the difficulty of writing bugfree code increases exponentially
as the size of the code increases. This is one of Linux's major
strengths over MicroSquish. M$ has too much code with too much
interaction. I installed Internet Exploder 5.0 on an NT box last
month and my laser beam recorder control software stopped working!
Linux does this much better, QNX better still.
There is a lot more info than this electronics expert/software dummy
can explain. Take a look at the architecture guide on www.qnx.com.
Here are some disadvanteges to the present QNX implementation:
[1] no matter what anyone claims, the QNX architecture has overhead
from passing messages. This is well hidden because QNX was
designed to be very fast, but a Linux style kernel that was
written to be equally fast should be able to outspeed QNX.
Then again, a huge monolithic program with everything able
to walk all over everything else would be faster still.
[2] No swapping memory to a pagefile on disk. Probably will never
happen, because of the major effect on real-time programs.
[3] Closed Source. Single vendor.
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Guy Macon)
Crossposted-To: comp.os.qnx,comp.sys.amiga.misc
Subject: Re: Amiga, QNX, Linux and Revolution
Date: 05 Sep 1999 03:02:49 PDT
In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Igor Kovalenko)
wrote:
>
>Guy Macon wrote:
>>
>> Ask any
>> QNX programmer what the QNX equivelant of a kernel panic is - I sure
>> don't know, because I have never seen the QNX kernel crash.
>>
>
>Regret to say that, but do not exaggregate. I've seen QNX kernel crash 2
>or 3 times in last 8 years. And I've seen NTO kernel crash once. I've
>also seen NTO kernel going into the state which is not crash, but
>renders the whole system zombie. Well, let's give NTO an excuse, it is
>an infant yet.
>
>To be exact however, those were not really microkernel crashes. It is
>indeed so small that there is simply no space for bugs. Those were
>process manager crashes, but that essentially equivalent to "kernel
>panic", since you can't really restart it.
Let me guess... Did the error message say "Guru Meditation"? ;)
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (John Grant)
Subject: anyone know how to make system.map?
Date: 5 Sep 1999 10:32:07 GMT
I accidentally blew mine away. Unfortunately, I'm in the middle of
working on a new kernel and I don't want to disturb the existing config,
Is there some way to generate a new one from an existing kernel?
------------------------------
From: "A.PADMANARAYANAN" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Instant messaging inside a network
Date: Sun, 5 Sep 1999 16:04:39 +0530
hey there is ICQ for LINUX actualy its the java version for linux.
its in www.icq.com/download
vijay
Anand Bisen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:7qudq0$4if$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> Hello
>
> Is it possible to run ICQ or something of that sort inside a internal
> network settuped on linux (to be more precise peer to peer on BNC coaxial
> cable)
>
> if yes then please advice
>
> thanks
>
>
>
>
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (AGX)
Subject: pppd-2.3.7 with kernel-2.2.10 problem
Date: 5 Sep 1999 10:31:15 GMT
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Hi,
i've ever used kernel 2.0.x
now i'm passing to the 2.2.x series and i'm gotting problem
connecting to my isp.
I tested with
kernel 2.2.10
pppd 2.3.7
I currently go online using:
pppd call my_ISP
This is my chatscript ...
TIMEOUT 10
ABORT "BUSY"
ABORT "NO ANSWER"
ABORT "NO CARRIER"
ABORT "ERROR"
ABORT "NO DIALTONE"
ABORT "nvalid"
ABORT "correct"
"" "at"
OK "atz"
OK "at E1 Q0 S0=0 &C1 &S0 l3"
OK "at x1"
TIMEOUT 60
OK "at dt 0823-937721"
CONNECT ''
ogin:--ogin: mickeymouse
assword: myckeymouse
This is my peer file ...
/dev/ttyS1 crtscts 115200 modem ms-dns 192.168.0.1 ms-dns 151.99.125.2
connect "chat -v -f /etc/ppp/chatscripts/nuovo"
noauth defaultroute
But, after connecting, i was unable to use any programs and to use
any socketes.
If i ping, lookup, or try tracerouting any hosts, they reply and every
things works happy. Instead if i try to use fetchmail, slrnpull and
any other programs that use SOCKETS i get problems.
I tried also to telnetting the port 110 of my mail-server.
telnet mailserver.disney.com 110
It just answer
"Trying 151.54.56.67 ....."
so it seems a problem at socket level instead of network.
He you are some diagnostics things ...
Those are the from the logs ...
Sep 5 11:12:25 uglypenguin pppd[23629]: pppd 2.3.7 started by root, uid 0
Sep 5 11:12:57 uglypenguin pppd[23629]: Connect: ppp0 <--> /dev/ttyS1
Sep 5 11:12:57 uglypenguin pppd[23629]: Serial connection established.
Sep 5 11:12:57 uglypenguin pppd[23629]: Using interface ppp0
Sep 5 11:13:03 uglypenguin modprobe: can't locate module ppp-compress-21
Sep 5 11:13:03 uglypenguin modprobe: can't locate module ppp-compress-26
Sep 5 11:13:03 uglypenguin modprobe: can't locate module ppp-compress-24
Sep 5 11:13:04 uglypenguin pppd[23629]: local IP address 194.243.244.245
Sep 5 11:13:04 uglypenguin pppd[23629]: remote IP address 194.243.244.226
Sep 5 11:13:04 uglypenguin pppd[23629]: proc file system not mounted
This is the routing table (route -n) after the connection .....
Kernel IP routing table
Destination Gateway Genmask Flags Metric Ref Use Iface
194.243.244.226 0.0.0.0 255.255.255.255 UH 0 0 0 ppp0
0.0.0.0 194.243.244.226 0.0.0.0 UG 0 0 0 ppp0
This is the output from ifconfig ...
lo Link encap:Local Loopback
inet addr:127.0.0.1 Mask:255.0.0.0
UP LOOPBACK RUNNING MTU:3924 Metric:1
RX packets:12 errors:0 dropped:0 overruns:0 frame:0
TX packets:12 errors:0 dropped:0 overruns:0 carrier:0
collisions:0 txqueuelen:0
ppp0 Link encap:Point-to-Point Protocol
inet addr:194.243.244.245 P-t-P:194.243.244.226 Mask:255.255.255.255
UP POINTOPOINT RUNNING NOARP MULTICAST MTU:1500 Metric:1
RX packets:13 errors:0 dropped:0 overruns:0 frame:0
TX packets:18 errors:0 dropped:0 overruns:0 carrier:0
collisions:0 txqueuelen:10
Sincerly i don't know what to do know.
Hoping that someone could help me.... :-)
My best regards,
AGX
P.S.
Forgive my bad english :-)
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Villy Kruse)
Crossposted-To: comp.os.linux.setup
Subject: Re: Wrong time setup?
Date: 5 Sep 1999 12:44:56 +0200
Jack Zhu <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>THanks, but how can I do this?
On redhat systems use 'timeconfig'; one of the options when you run 'setup'.
Then use setclock to sync the RTC clock.
--
Villy
------------------------------
From: "SteveNews" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Mandrake Install Problem: No such file or directory
Date: Sun, 5 Sep 1999 11:54:20 +0100
Dear All,
Let me first stress by saying I am a complete newbie to partitions and
Linux...
I am currently trying to install Linux-Mandrake 6.0 as a dual-boot with
Win98
but I have hit a problem.
I first setup "Linux Native" and "Linux Swap" partitions using Partition
Magic.
When I then tried to install Linux I got as far the "Current Disk
Partitions" screen (after
selecting Disk Druid).
I mounted the "Linux Native" partition to "/" and added another native
partition to "/home".
(as suggested in the manual).
I then saved this and another screen popped up saying "Swap Disk not found"
(or
something like that). This was followed by another error:
"An error occured reading the partition tabel for block device hda. The
error
was: No such file or directory"
I selected "Retry" but nothing happened so I selected "Skip Drive" which
brought
up another error message:
"An error occured. No valid devices were found on which to create new
filesystems.
Please check your hardware for the cause of this problem."
After this it got stuck in a loop and I had to CTRL-ALT-DEL.
I tried to start from scratch by removing/regenerating the Partitions but
now I cannot
get any further in the install process than the "Disk Setup" screen (where
you select
either Disk Druid or fdisk before the above errors occur.
Any ideas?
Many thanks for any help.
Cheers,
Steve
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Hans Wolters)
Crossposted-To: poster
Subject: Re: anyone know how to make system.map?
Date: 5 Sep 1999 11:03:56 GMT
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
John Grant <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> found a keyboard
and could not resist the temptation ....
>I accidentally blew mine away. Unfortunately, I'm in the middle of
>working on a new kernel and I don't want to disturb the existing config,
>Is there some way to generate a new one from an existing kernel?
Hi John,
A new System.map will be created in your /usr/src/linux. Copy the
thing to the correct location (where your new kernel is)
Chau Hans
--
Linux / Com21 / CMI8330 / FAQ/Linux search / Netbus detector
http://linux.gelrevision.nl/index.shtml
------------------------------
From: "Boon Yeo" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: chat script with ISP menu selection problem
Date: Sun, 5 Sep 1999 21:07:47 +1000
Hi folks,
My ISP, at this moment, is Linux unfriendly
[I'd have to move to another if they don't
fix that soon].
I had Linux ppp with my ISP until recently,
when they change their setup on me. Now,
I'd have to reconfigure the connection.
But I encounter a problem. There is now
a menu of which one of the option is ppp.
I use chap-secrets and pap-secrets and I
cannot find any documentations (have read
all the available HOWTO's) which would
allow me to select the option -- without
imbedding my login and password into the
ppp-on-dialer script file.
Any help is much appreciated.
Thanks,
Boon
------------------------------
From: Steve Gage <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.linux.advocacy
Subject: Re: General Rant from a Linux Newbie
Date: Sun, 05 Sep 1999 11:15:05 GMT
Lizard wrote:
> was working, etc. Tried to launch Netscape. Nothing happened. Tried some
> other apps. Nothing happened. Tried to logout (this is all under Gnome,
> BTW). Nothing happened. No windows could open, it seemed. Finally had to do
> a power-down to get out of it.
Netscape is quite probably the most fragile program I've run under
Linux. You probably didn't have to power down, though. Ctl-Alt-Fx to
another console, log in as root, run ps ax |grep netscape to find the
process number, and kill the errant Netscape process. If worse comes to
worst, Ctl-Alt-Bkspc will kill X.
> c)Not quite a crash, but several times, when I have tried to go to a page
> that 404s under netscape, netscape just closes down. Charming again. (Go to
> the Linuxberg page, go to Gnome software, go to Newsreaders, click on the
> first one, it's the only 5-penguin product. Try to go to the home page.
> Kaboom!)
Sounds like the java problem - see the RH site for the fix.
> d)A few other crashes, I forget the circumstances. Rather than the robust
> he-man operating system I was expecting, I find I am terrified to do
> anything, for fear of having to reboot yet again.
You're blaming Linux for buggy software. Again, you almost certainly
didn't need to reboot, even if X gets hosed by a buggy program. I think
I have had to hard-reset maybe 3 times in the 2 years I've been
hammering on Linux. Learn about ps and kill.
> Now, on to software. First off, has anyone thought of putting in the
> INSTALL text file words to the effect of "you better untar this from /,
> otherwise, you'll end up creating a zillion useless directories where you
> don't want them because there's no way to tell tar to go to the root to
> start?" Apparently not. Do not assume your users intuitively know where
> software is 'supposed' to go, especially if they've been trained on OSes
> that don't give a damn.
There is a learning curve, all right. Yes, sometimes installing a
program can be convoluted. That's why RPM was invented. It works quite
well. You can find RPMs for just about anything at Freshmeat or some of
the other repositories.
> Is it just me, or is X rather, uhm, sluggish? I have a PII 400 and the
> whole GUI felt like it was running in molasses. Is there some 'trick' to
> speeding it up?
I'm not sure of any trick, but something seems radically wrong. On my
lowly 200 MHz Pentium, X with Window Maker is very fast.
> Directories do not need version names, especially for enduser apps.
> 'FooBar1.01-45A-intel-linux-2.0' is a *stupid* name for a directory. (Or a
> file, for that matter). Since the Macintosh, which also permits very long
> file names, is NOT afflicted with this sort of nonsense, I don't see why
> Linux has to be.
There is important information in those funky filenames. You have a
multi-platform system, with many tools and apps being very actively
developed, and things need to be distinguished. It's not nonsense.
You'll get used to using the TAB key to expand things very easily. Or
use FileRunner or some other graphical file manager.
In spite of recent advances in installation and desktop environments,
Linux still has plenty of curveballs for the novice. But I found it well
worth it to just hang in there. Linux will pay you back great dividends
for whatever you invest in it.
- Steve
------------------------------
From: Steve Gage <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Netscape color
Date: Sun, 05 Sep 1999 11:20:08 GMT
ORRIN wrote:
>
> I noticed that the copy of Netscape (4.5.1) that came with my copy of
> SuSE 6.1, has a black & white heading and icons rather than color like
> my old Windows version. It that the way it is, or is there a way to
> fix it. I didn't see anything in the options.
Netscape shows black&white if you run at 24 bpp or higher color depth -
an artifact of Motif, I think. You can either drop to 16 bpp if you
really need to see color icons, or get used to it.
- Steve
>
> -----------------------------
> Orrin - Long Island, New York
> Orrin's Caribbean Index - http://www.orrin.org/carib/
> Syosset Camera Club - http://www.orrin.org/syocc/
> HS Class Reunion - http://www.orrin.org/wphs/
> Our e-mail address is at http://www.orrin.org/email.html
------------------------------
From: Anthony Valentine <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: *nix vs. MS security
Date: Sun, 05 Sep 1999 03:31:52 -0800
Mark Bratcher wrote:
> Christopher,
>
> Thanks for bringing up that topic. :-)
>
> > I'm taking a class on operating systems. During the last class, the
> > instructor mentioned that *nices are less reliable and less secure than
> > Microsoft OS's. His reasoning is that because *nices (espeically linux)
> is
> > free and everyone has access to it, it's less secure. Random people can
> > hack into a *nix system easier because they can figure out the interrupts
> > and stuff, since it's a free OS.
>
> That's a ridiculous argument. Public domain doesn't make something easier
> to crack. As an example, the DES encryption standard is public domain. You
> can even find code that implements it. But it is very secure (albeit, it
> has been superceded now).
>
> How secure is Windows NT? Well, here's an example. We have NT 4.0 running
> here. My administrator (a rooky right out of school) forgot his Admin
> password. He didn't know what to do at first, but after searching the WWW
> for 5 minutes he obtained information that allowed him to crack it easily.
> I've been trying to figure out why NT is rated C2 secure...duh.
>
Windows security does indeed suck, but it's worse than that. It has been
discovered recently that M$ has installed a back door into all versions of
Windows (95 and up) to allow the NSA the ability to access your computer.
Here's the article: http://www.cryptonym.com/hottopics/msft-nsa.html
Now that's scary shit.
AV
------------------------------
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