I've seen some very interesting points in this thread and feel compelled to comment.
Why would you want to limit your choices to internal/external clinical/technical? I've seen IT types who were rude and insulting to anyone who couldn't write scripts in VBA, and I've worked with nurses who considered anyone in a hospital setting without a clinical background to be worthless. On the other hand I've seen nurses who used their intelligence, curiosity, clinical knowledge, and people management skills to wonderful effect in the IT setting. The same goes for IT types; some are willing learners who work great with clinical folks and are truly interested in improving the systems to facilitate better patient care. If you exclude any group from consideration your potential talent pool shrinks. Fact is, hiring great people requires hard work and due diligence in checking references no mater what skill set a candidate brings to the interview table. And to Gord: I love your ideas about how managers can keep IT staff happy, in fact, I think I had one of those managers a few years back (here, a wistful tear falls). However, any HR department that refuses to pay based on education and experience rather than job title deserves what they get in turnover. Once an employee gets on that IT (or other) pay scale they stay there no matter how brilliant their achievements in the job. Changing jobs (and employers) is the only way to get on a better scale. I speak from experience both clinical and financial and within IS. I know this doesn't help the original poster, but it's my 2 cents. Tim Richardson Senior Consultant maxIT HealthCare ________________________________ From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jordan, Shane Sent: Tuesday, July 24, 2007 1:12 PM To: Kay Morgan; Lapointe, Carol (R5); Gord Dowling; Cyndy G. Zoch; [email protected] Subject: Re: [MEDITECH-L] how do you recruit analysts? I think this topic is becoming more of a battle between IT and Clinical....... So, on that note.... IT people have to stay up all night to finish the project, because they have a list that continues to grow and don't get additional assistance, they work through lunch, because they don't want to lose that time when they could have been working. They have to follow confusing directions, because they have to be able to interpret a general user that uses terminology only they (the general user) understand.... :-) Shane Jordan Systems Analyst II Fairmont General Hospital Phone: 304-368-4572 Fax: 304-367-7176 Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> "It's not broken, it does exactly what the code told it to do" ________________________________ From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Kay Morgan Sent: Tuesday, July 24, 2007 1:06 PM To: 'Lapointe, Carol (R5)'; 'Gord Dowling'; 'Cyndy G. Zoch'; [email protected] Subject: Re: [MEDITECH-L] how do you recruit analysts? Carol, how much time do you spend in a month in a patient care area? IT people tend to stay in the IT dept Learning the language is great and not discounting your wonderful efforts because there is always 1 in a million and you are probably it... my choice would be clinical IT people focus on Rules and equipment. Clinical people usually are used to dealing with out of the ordinary, working with out dated and obsolete equipment to meet all kinds of impossible goals (like keeping people alive that should have been dead years ago) being chewed up and spat out by Dr's, patient's and families and other depts, are unable to ignore a challenge and are used to multitasking, have bladders that expand to 3000cc's , eat on the fly and are generally self sacrificing....used to working all shifts . And they can follow very confusing directions.......which is the essence of Meditech....ha ha :-) By the way carol if you are this 1 in a million that understands what I've just said give me a call we will have lots to share and I could get you a good job in the south...:-) Kay H. Morgan, RN Nursing Informatics/Clinical Analyst 256-386-4373 -----Original Message----- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Lapointe, Carol (R5) Sent: Tuesday, July 24, 2007 8:55 AM To: Gord Dowling; Cyndy G. Zoch; [email protected] Subject: Re: [MEDITECH-L] how do you recruit analysts? Heh.. don't shut the door on IT ... we're smart people too, generally. :-) I have an IT background, been here almost 13 years.. and yes, I've learned lots about health care, the same way health-care people would learn IT. I can't imagine I'm the only IT person out here that was able to learn health care??? Maybe I am.....hmmmmm.....$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ Carol Lapointe Senior Systems Analyst - Régie de la santé du Restigouche/Restigouche Health Authority Campbellton, NB, Canada [EMAIL PROTECTED] ________________________________ From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Gord Dowling Sent: July 23, 2007 7:34 PM To: Cyndy G. Zoch; [email protected] Subject: Re: [MEDITECH-L] how do you recruit analysts? Hi Cindy, Sorry to hear your troubles. I do not do the recruiting here but do have some thoughts on the subject. If at all possible recruit from the outside, clinical people, in their mid to late 30s, who have migrated to IT. They are smart people, generally. You can teach them enough of Meditech and how the dictionaries/parameters affect everything in a few months. IT people tend to come from the finance and manufacturing world. It's a whole other culture. While many are brilliant, they don't generally understand what all goes into good patient care and become confused by the expectations of the new clientele (nurses, doctors, technologists, and technicians). They find the language of medicine to be totally foreign. That said, for operations/networks hire IT. That's their niche. The reason you should prefer outside over inside is politics, and man-management. If the new hire has no history with the staff they are going to deal with day-to-day it will be easier for that staff to take direction/advice from the analyst. The downside to this is that the new-hire has to be brought up to speed on the internal politics of the place while they are trying to learn the new system. Not a new problem. The IT industry recognizes that it takes 3 months to acclimatize an IT new-hire when they migrate from one position to another. We are no different in that respect. Why mid to late 30s? It takes time to acquire a clinical skill set and an IT skill set. Ten years in a hospital makes you 28 before you even start thinking about migrating on to IT. As per your question about pay... Once you train someone to be a Meditech Clinical of Financial Analyst they become targets for recruiters. The better their reputation in the Meditech world, the heavier the recruiting gets. Poaching by your peer hospitals becomes business fact regardless of backroom agreements to the contrary. Your challenge as a manager is to build staff loyalty to the organization, to the department, and to yourself. Dollars are a factor at the organization level. If the recruiters can offer a betterment of life-style, you will have a problem. Note that life-style is not wages. Wages help drive lifestyle changes. If the lifestyle of the IT analyst is perceived by the analyst to be significantly inferior to their peers on the clinical side of the house, you as the manager need to find a way to overcome that perception. If you've hired an RN to be your nursing analyst and the nurses are paid better than she is, the difference had better be lifestyle. (No shift-work, reduced exposure to occupational hazards, cleaner working environment, air-conditioning, a perceived support of the manager they work for. You get the idea.) On the reverse side of that equation, if you aren't able to provide a happy workplace, you better open the cash drawer. Even that won't be enough since the recruiters currently promise nirvana in addition to the dollars. Gord Gordon Dowling [EMAIL PROTECTED] <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Applications Analyst Huron Perth Healthcare Alliance Stratford, ON N5A 2Y6 (519)272-8210 ext2268 ________________________________ From: Cyndy G. Zoch [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, July 20, 2007 1:50 PM To: [email protected] Subject: [MEDITECH-L] how do you recruit analysts? Hello, For the 4th time in less than a year, we are having to fill the position of Clinical Analyst. In the past, we have brought in people from the outside that have had varying degrees of experience with Meditech. Two of the three have left the organization. The third took another position within the organization. We are now re-evaluating our recruitment strategy. I'm wondering how you handle recruitment for such a position and what success you have had with specific strategies. Specifically, I'd like to know: 1. Do you recruit from the outside or do you try to find someone in-house to take the position? 2. If you select someone from in-house, do you find it's best if they have clinical knowledge and then teach them Meditech or do you try to find people that are IT savvy and teach them the clinical pieces? 3. If you start with a clinical person, how do you convince them to switch over to IT? Right now, our clinical employees make much more than our clinical analyst position pays. Have you had to adjust your pay scales so that analyst salaries are in line with clinical salaries? 4. Any other advice or suggestions you have Thanks in advance for your help! Cyndy Zoch Information/Public Relations Division Director Trinity Medical Center 700 Medical Parkway Brenham, TX 77833 (979)830-7438 [EMAIL PROTECTED] This e-mail and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. Any unauthorized dissemination, review, distribution or copying of these communications is strictly prohibited. If you have received this e-mail in error, please notify Trinity Medical Center - Cyndy Zoch at 979-830-7438 and delete or destroy the message. ________________________________ . 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