Yep and I think if you ask Errol nicely, he might even back me up on that. With the BDA, they were easy. Four tailshaft bolts, six bolts holding the gearbox to the bellhousing (two from inside the car) and a circlip on the gearshift plus the rear X-member. These were ZF boxes modded for competition, so they were designed to come out quickly. BTW, 16 minutes with two people is 32 man minutes. I know it sounds unreal but when you are competing, it's amazing what you can achieve. Also, the car only had to go another 100 Km or so. We weren't too worried if it blew again (after the event!)
-----Original Message----- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] On Behalf Of mark krawczuk Sent: Tuesday, 18 February 2003 5:36 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: L6 Head Removal/Refitting what , change a head in 16 minutes, change a gear box in 12---- no way i say... mark k ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lach" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Tuesday, February 18, 2003 4:49 PM Subject: RE: L6 Head Removal/Refitting > In the '70s, we were running a 1600 for Greg Carr in one of the > Castrol Rallies here in Canberra. On the final day, the car blew a > head gasket. Two of us changed the gasket and had the car out of > service in 16 minutes. He went on to win the event. Did a gearbox in a > BDA Escort in the Queensland mud in 12 minutes, but that's another > story. > > -----Original Message----- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] On Behalf Of James > Fitness > Sent: Tuesday, 18 February 2003 2:23 PM > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Subject: Re: L6 Head Removal/Refitting > > > Back when I was 18, I was driving from Melb to QLD and had the > headgasket blow on my 1600 just out of Lismore (ok so I was going the > long way :) > > I ended up stopping at the local Nissan dealer and begging them to let > me use their tools cause I had none and little money... anyway to cut > a long story short - 3 hours later and $50 for a new gasket and I was > back on the road... > > They were still shaking their heads as I pulled out of their driveway > casue they still didn't believe that I had gotten it all done in that > time ! > > > > > Zac Campbell wrote: > > > yeah I'm serious, though I've done just about everything else on an > > L-series except remove the head, and done a head on another make. > > Another thing, I didn't remove the manifolds, it was only 8 nuts to > > remove the carb and turbo - saved a lot of time! > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Bob" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > Sent: Tuesday, February 18, 2003 11:53 AM > > Subject: Re: L6 Head Removal/Refitting > > > > > 3 hours?? It took me and a make about 4 to just get it off - > > > though we were working at hangover speed.. Ill second the quality > > > of the info I have received on this post, it makes the job heaps > > > easier. The head is going into a shop tomorrow minus the cam etc > > > to be serviced, I was going to do the valves etc myself, but have > > > decided to leave that bit to those older, wiser, and more > > > qualified. > > > > > > On Sun, 2003-02-16 at 12:22, Zac Campbell wrote: > > > > Bob, how did you go doing the head work on the L6? I did mine on > > > > the > > L20b on > > > > saturday and surprised myself by having the car running again in > > > > no > > longer > > > > than 3 hours! Mind you Terry's walk through helped. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > From: "Terry Rudd" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > > > To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > > > Sent: Sunday, February 16, 2003 3:19 AM > > > > Subject: RE: L6 Head Removal/Refitting > > > > > > > > > > > > > Andrew, > > > > > > > > > > Thanks for pointing out - yes I did mean to say always change > > > > > the > > valve > > > > stem > > > > > seals. We occasionally went to the considerable trouble of > > > > > changing > > the > > > > > guides on a few heads in the early days - pretty expensive > > > > > back then > > too > > > > and > > > > > not really worth it for a street engine and cheaper to toss > > > > > the head > > and > > > > go > > > > > downtown to the wreckers and grab another - I guess it really > > > > > depends > > on > > > > how > > > > > much has been put into other mods like big valves and porting > > > > > etc. I'm > > not > > > > > sure how it's done these days, back then you had to dunk > > > > > things in a > > very > > > > > hot oil bath, as I said tres exy as it was very labour > > > > > intensive > > > > > > and > > no > > > > way > > > > > to do it without the correct gear. Stem seals seem to be made > > > > > out of a better class of materials these days also, I've seen > > > > > genuine seals > > totally > > > > > stuffed in 70-80K kays, my last set on the old L engine have > > > > > done 100K > > > > kays > > > > > and still no signs of anything getting down past them, but the > > > > > guides > > are > > > > > absolutely kangaroo teds brother, sorry that's probably a 30yo > > > > colloquialism > > > > > (roo ted). > > > > > > > > > > regards > > > > > Terry > > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > > > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > > > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of > > > > > GREENBURY, Andrew Robert > > > > > Sent: Saturday, 15 February 2003 4:19 PM > > > > > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > > > Subject: RE: L6 Head Removal/Refitting > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Terry, > > > > > > > > > > Excellent informative post. > > > > > > > > > > You mention: > > > > > "change the valve guides (always with an old L head as the > > > > > guides > > wear)" > > > > > Do you mean with every head removal the valve guides should be > > renewed? Or > > > > > just the valve stem seals? If you meant guides, have you got > > > > > an > > indicative > > > > > price for this work, figuring its not DIY. > > > > > > > > > > Thanks > > > > > Andrew > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Bob, > > > > > > > > > > The L6 heads are much the same deal as the L4 - I have a > > > > > feeling > > > > > > that > > this > > > > > is going to turn into an essay, writing about playing with > > > > > heads > > > > > > invariable does. It's always a good idea to get hold of a > > > > > workshop manual for reference when doing this sort of thing > > > > > for the first time too. Good > quality > > tools > > > > > especially the tension wrench make a rough job into a good > > > > > job. > > > > > > > > > > Here's a bit of a technical guide to pulling a head the > > > > > correct way, > > i.e. > > > > > make that the way that an SOB like me was taught to do it on a > > > > > L > > engine 30 > > > > > years ago by one of the best rally teams around. > > > > > > > > > > Remove the bits and pieces to allow you to remove the rocker > > > > > cover - > > I'll > > > > > start from there. > > > > > > > > > > Remove the plugs and rotate the engine by hand to exactly TDC > > induction > > > > > stroke on #1 cylinder; if you go past TDC, then rotate the > > > > > engine thru > > 700 > > > > > plus degrees i.e. nearly twice more to do it again - it's not > > > > > nice to > > turn > > > > > an OHC engine backwards, if we got caught doing it in my > > > > > learning > > years it > > > > > was worth a swift kick up the bum accompanied with a good > > > > > verballing. > > When > > > > > satisfied it's in the correct position, check that valves on > > > > > #1 are > > both > > > > > closed, to be sure you can check that the valves on #6 are > > > > > open. > > > > > > > > > > Note the position of the V in the timing wheel in relation to > > > > > the > > notch in > > > > > the cam thrust plate, the V to the left of the notch is valve > > > > > timing retarded (possible stretched chain), in the centre is > > > > > neutral as in > > stock, > > > > > and to the right indicates the timing is advanced; > > > > > > > > > > Note which position (i.e. P1, P2 or P3) the dowel in the cam > > > > > is > > positioned > > > > > on the timing wheel; factory is Pos 1, if it's anywhere else > > > > > then it's > > had > > > > > the human touch applied to it, i.e. the valve timing has been > > > > > advanced > > for > > > > > some reason sometime in it's past. > > > > > > > > > > OK, if the cam dowel is in P1 and notch in centre of the V is > > > > > as > > > > > > it > > left > > > > > the > > > > > factory and indicates that the cam chain isn't stretched. You > > > > > may wish > > to > > > > > consider using P2 when putting it back together for a small > > > > > amount of valve timing advance (4 degrees on a L4 anyway, I > > > > > think the L6 is the same > > but > > > > > I'm > > > > > not absolutely certain of this). Just a word of caution with > > > > > playing > > with > > > > > valve timing on the L6, they seem to be a lot more sensitive > > > > > to minor advance, if you don't change anything else then > > > > > things like heaps more grunt mid revs and then absolutely out > > > > > of breath > > > > > > at 5000 rpm can happen - > > it's > > > > > happened to me a few times on carbie fed L26 engines, and by > > > > > returning > > the > > > > > timing to stock it revs to 6000 + as before - could have been > > > > > just > > this > > > > > engine, jury out on that one and I haven't had a L6 apart in > > > > > 20 years > > to > > > > > play some more. > > > > > > > > > > Check the position of the rotor i.e. is it pointing towards > > > > > the front (true #1 position) or the rear (180 degrees out) - > > > > > useful to know when > > you're > > > > > trouble shooting. > > > > > > > > > > Collecting this information before you pull it apart gives you > > > > > a > > > > > > good insight into getting a nicely performing L engine after a > > > > > head > > rebuild. > > > > > > > > > > Use the trusty old solid wooden chock (don't use particle > > > > > board and > > the > > > > > like) to hold the cam tensioner in place - dimensions are > > > > > 160mm long, > > 32mm > > > > > high along one end and 45mm high along the other - thickness > > > > > is > > important > > > > > too - around 10mm is good. A little trick to aid removal after > > > > > the > > wheel > > > > > and > > > > > chain is re-installed is to drill a hole in the top of the > > > > > 45mm end so > > you > > > > > can get the tool out - it's prone to sticking so you can > > > > > thread > > something > > > > > fairly strong through the hole eg a leather shoe lace is good > > > > > (I > > nearly > > > > > lifted an engine off its mounts when attempting to get it out > > > > > once). > > The > > > > > straight edge of the chock goes in along the straight guide > > > > > i.e. > > passenger > > > > > side; > > > > > > > > > > As a bit of insurance, you can mark a link and it's position > > > > > on the > > timing > > > > > wheel, so you know for sure you re-install it in the same > > > > > place, > > providing > > > > > you don't change the location of the cam dowel in a different > > > > > P > > number. > > > > > Undo > > > > > the cam retaining bolt and remove the timing wheel from the > > > > > chain. > > It's > > > > > important to keep track of where you remove bits from as > > > > > everything > > should > > > > > be returned to where it came from - this really only applies > > > > > to head bolts, valve springs and seating washers, collets, > > > > > rockers etc. Bits like > > mani > > > > > bolts etc are not important. Make sure that you know the head > > > > > bolt > > removal > > > > > sequence, on most engines it is the reverse of the tightening > > > > > sequence > > as > > > > > shown on the VRS set. > > > > > > > > > > Once you've removed the head then remove each valve, (remember > > > > > to > > label or > > > > > use some method to identify where it belongs), check the > > > > > valves aren't bent i.e. slide in the guides easily, change the > > > > > valve guides (always with > > an > > > > > old > > > > > L head as the guides wear), de-coke the valves, check the > > > > > seats for > > blow > > > > > by > > > > > and correct as required, check that the head is flat and > > > > > serviceable, > > by > > > > > serviceable L series head has all of the letters in "NISSAN" > > > > > along the lower edge towards the front cylinder visible, if > > > > > it's > > > > > > on the limit and you > > need > > > > > to shave it further to true, then it's head saver time, or > > > > > better you > > will > > > > > need to source another head. > > > > > > > > > > Don't forget check that the cam dowel is tight in the end of > > > > > the > > > > > > cam, > > grab > > > > > hold of it with a pair of pliers and check that it's tight > > > > > i.e. it > > wont > > > > > rotate in it's hole and there's no sign of cracking around it > > > > > where it locates in the end of the camshaft. It's not usually > > > > > a major problem > > in a > > > > > Datto L but none the less they'll grenade real bad if that > > > > > dowel > > > > > > comes adrift. > > > > > > > > > > Re-installation is pretty much the reverse, make sure the > > > > > surfaces are > > as > > > > > clean as you can get them. After the head is torqued down, pay > > particular > > > > > attention to relocating the cam timing wheel in the correct or > > > > > chosen position, as this is the part that ppl find difficult - > > > > > it's not > > really > > > > > that > > > > > hard if you follow the tear down tips. If it's not in the > > > > > correct > > position > > > > > on an L engine it's going to show up as the engine is turned > > > > > over > > during > > > > > the > > > > > valve adjustment process. I recommend that the crankshaft is > > > > > turned > > over > > > > > by > > > > > hand thru a further 720 degrees after completing the rocker > > adjustments to > > > > > be sure before the starter is hit for the first time. If you > > > > > changed > > the > > > > > dowel position to adjust the valve timing, it is quite normal > > > > > to > > > > > > have > > to > > > > > rotate the cam a fraction (around 4 degrees for each number) > > > > > to refit > > the > > > > > timing wheel. > > > > > > > > > > I would only recommend that you get stuck into the inlet ports > > > > > if you > > have > > > > > had some experience - we practiced this sort of stuff on a > > > > > stuffed as > > in > > > > > cracked or something head to explore the limits and perfect > > > > > technique. > > The > > > > > novice can fairly safely use a dremel and some fine wet & dry > > > > > to > > polish > > > > > the > > > > > ports, but that's all I'd do unless you are comfortable with > > > > > delving further. > > > > > > > > > > if you're still reading this you will have a bit of an insight > > > > > into a routine L series head service. > > > > > > > > > > Have fun with it, > > > > > > > > > > regards > > > > > Terry > > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > > > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > > > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Bob > > > > > Sent: Monday, 10 February 2003 9:57 PM > > > > > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > > > Subject: L6 Head Removal/Refitting > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Hi All, > > > > > > > > > > Ive ordered in my VRS kit and will be changing the head gasket > > > > > shortly. I have only taken a head off once before, are there > > > > > any > > > > > > special tricks with the L series that I should do? I looked > > > > > throught the archives and saw plenty of trouble with the chain > > > > > tensioner slipping, how can I try to avoid that? Also, is it > > > > > worth cleaning up an E88 head at home with a die grinder, is > > > > > there anything worthwhile that can be achieved by a > > > > > backyarder? > > > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > Bob > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > Bob <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > > > > > > > > > -- > ----------------------------------------------------------- > > James Fitness > Director > Data Scribe Australia Pty Ltd > http://www.datascribe.com.au > Computers, Peripherals and Supplies > > > Ozdat Online > Webmaster > http://www.ozdat.com > > > --membersozdat------------------------------------------------------- > OZDAT Mailing List Please Note:- > Send (un)subscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Send > submissions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] No unauthorised > redistribution of this email > http://www.ozdat.com/ozdatonline/index.htm > http://www.ozdat.com/ozdatonline/listindex.html > http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/ > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > --membersozdat------------------------------------------------------- OZDAT Mailing List Please Note:- Send (un)subscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Send submissions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] No unauthorised redistribution of this email http://www.ozdat.com/ozdatonline/index.htm http://www.ozdat.com/ozdatonline/listindex.html http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/ --------------------------------------------------------------------- --membersozdat------------------------------------------------------- OZDAT Mailing List Please Note:- Send (un)subscribe requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Send submissions to [EMAIL PROTECTED] No unauthorised redistribution of this email http://www.ozdat.com/ozdatonline/index.htm http://www.ozdat.com/ozdatonline/listindex.html http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/ ---------------------------------------------------------------------
