There have long been killing sprees like this - Foucault brought the case of one to light in a paper, suggesting we listen to the account directly rather than through 'psychologists'. I doubt people like this can be stopped through better understanding. Perhaps we should declare free range on gun collectors and then arrest the survivors? Craig will undoubtedly support this position! I think some people might kill in order to ensure a therapist for life.
On 14 Mar, 11:41, Slip Disc <[email protected]> wrote: > We can't assume that social conditions had any influence on little > Tim. He's described as a reclusive with some obsessive patterns. > Would he had spent more time in social settings and extra curricular > activities, there might have been a more positive outcome. I've seen > how wealth can sometimes turn children into a type of family bi > product with the idea that money can provide all the nurturing > necessary for healthy development. Tim was cold and calculated in his > intent lacking both emotional and rational aspects, probably a > mentally wired zombie. It is really too bad he wasn't still alive, as > the results of his psychoanalysis could provide a multitude of > information that might prevent future breakdowns. > > On Mar 13, 11:38 am, ornamentalmind <[email protected]> wrote: > > > "... One of the problems is conditions allowing the emotional rule > > over the rational." - bruce r. > > > Yes and another of the problems is the assumption that one's > > 'rational' aspect can rule over the emotional. > > > On Mar 13, 7:27 am, bruce ralph <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > Animals do have a basic "fight or flight" response. When it goes into > > > overdrive, it does result in sociopathic behaviour. We have to > > > reexamine the the societal conditions that result in people "going > > > off" like this. One of the problems is conditions allowing the > > > emotional rule over the rational. > > > > On Mar 13, 7:20 am, Don Johnson <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > Sigmund might say it's all to do with his relationship(or lack > > > > thereof) with his Mom. Kids at that age are dealing with raging > > > > hormones and other chemical changes that some find impossible to > > > > handle. It is unfortunate in the extreme that his therapy didn't pan > > > > out. Chances are if he could have toughed it out for a few more > > > > months his body and mind would have recovered. I can't imagine how > > > > guilty his parents must feel. It's a horrible thing. And so, so sad. > > > > Tragic applies. > > > > > dj > > > > > On Fri, Mar 13, 2009 at 4:34 AM, frantheman > > > > <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > Just to get the facts straight, Vam, it has since emerged that the > > > > > report that Tim K. had stated his intention to "whip up a storm" in a > > > > > chat room (Krautchan, a German clone of 4Chan) was incorrect. The > > > > > police had received reports of the entry in the chat room forum, which > > > > > later turned out to be false. But Rech, the interior minister, in a > > > > > move sadly typical for a politician, had already taken the photo- > > > > > oppportunity to go public with the news. > > > > > > Far from being on Ritalin (a popular, if often questionable treatment > > > > > for kids who are hyper and diagnosed as suffering from Attention- > > > > > Deficit-Syndrome), as Don suggests, Tim K. is universally described as > > > > > being quiet and somewhat withdrawn. Not, by any means, an over- > > > > > achiever, but also not a kid who fully fits into the omega-type, > > > > > weird, nerd-loser category in teenage group classification. He had > > > > > recently begun therapeutic treatment for depression but had > > > > > discontinued it. > > > > > > Part of the psychosis which drove K. to his killing spree may have had > > > > > something to do with gender issues, Slip. The vast majority of his > > > > > victims in the school were female, according to the reports, and most > > > > > were killed with aimed, intentional head shots (this kid was a trained > > > > > shooter). This, however, would seem to argue, in my view, for > > > > > traditional gender differentiation - speculatively, a generalised > > > > > aggression against females because particular girls had rejected his > > > > > advances. If he had been the subject of peer-group bullying/mobbing, > > > > > one would have expected more alpha-jock types amongst the victims. > > > > > While it might be interesting to discuss gender-related issues here, > > > > > Slip, my experience is that no group is more conservative and > > > > > traditional with regard to gender-differentiation than teenagers. > > > > > > Francis > > > > > > On 13 Mrz., 04:54, Vamadevananda <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > >> There is something material to this discussion : The ' boy ' had > > > > >> indicated his mind, in his own words, day before committing the > > > > >> mayhem. Let's hear. > > > > > >> "I have weapons here and tomorrow morning I will go to my old school > > > > >> and really whip up a storm," Tim Kretschmer, 17, said in a chat room, > > > > >> according to the interior minister of the state where Wednesday's > > > > >> massacre took place. > > > > > >> "I have had enough of this crummy life... Always the same. People are > > > > >> laughing at me, no-one recognises my potential... You will hear about > > > > >> me tomorrow. Make note of the name of the place: Winnenden," the > > > > >> posting said. > > > > > >> "He should have just killed himself," pensioner Hildegard Kronbach > > > > >> said as she stood on the church steps. > > > > > >> His father is a successful businessman who employs 150 people at a > > > > >> packaging firm, according to police, but his son found it difficult > > > > >> to > > > > >> fit in at school and had few friends. > > > > > >> "He was simply not accepted by anyone and just sat all day in front > > > > >> of > > > > >> his computer," Mario, a schoolmate, told German television station > > > > >> N24. > > > > > >> Reports also said he was keen on computer shooting games -- > > > > >> especially > > > > >> the violent "Counter-Strike" -- and had become a real-life crack shot > > > > >> at the shooting range where his father was a member. > > > > > >> After leaving school last year, Kretschmer had enrolled on a course > > > > >> to > > > > >> train as a salesman. He regularly worked out at the gym, belonged to > > > > >> a > > > > >> sports club and was a keen table tennis player. > > > > > >> His father owned more than a dozen guns, all locked away except the > > > > >> nine millimetre Beretta pistol that caused the carnage. Police also > > > > >> found 4,600 rounds of ammunition at the house. > > > > > >> Rech said Kretschmer had apparently cracked an eight-digit code to a > > > > >> locked cabinet containing guns and ammunition. > > > > > >> The killer had "destroyed the soul of an entire school and ripped > > > > >> into > > > > >> the heart of a town," Rech added. > > > > > >> The tragedy brought back haunting memories of a similar bloodbath in > > > > >> Erfurt in eastern Germany in 2002 that left 17 dead, including the > > > > >> gunman, and rekindled a gun-control debate. > > > > > >> Gun laws were tightened after Erfurt and there have already been > > > > >> calls > > > > >> for even stricter laws and also a ban on violent computer games. > > > > > >> The above were excerpts from The Guardian. The fact that the boy was > > > > >> filled with the sense of " unrecognised potential," despite having > > > > >> all > > > > >> ( compared to a teen in an average household in India ) materially, > > > > >> is > > > > >> what is most germane to the case. > > > > > >> On Mar 13, 3:42 am, frantheman <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > >> > The past few days have seen two frightening series of rampage > > > > >> > killings, in Alabama and in Southern > > > > >> > Germany:http://www.spiegel.de/international/germany/0,1518,612863,00.html > > > > >> > Living in Germany, and having a 17-year-old daughter going to > > > > >> > school > > > > >> > here, I've been hearing and reading quite a bit about our local > > > > >> > horror > > > > >> > in the past few days. It seems to have been a typical case of a > > > > >> > boy/ > > > > >> > young man with major mental/self-image problems irrevocably losing > > > > >> > it. > > > > > >> > The talking heads are waffling about the availability of weapons > > > > >> > (Tim > > > > >> > K. used a Beretta his father kept in his bedroom), graphic computer > > > > >> > games (Counterstrike) and all the other usual stuff. Despite my > > > > >> > oft- > > > > >> > posted abhorrence for privately-held guns, I don't really think > > > > >> > that > > > > >> > further gun control is the answer (not to this particular problem - > > > > >> > rampage killings take place in societies with tight and with lax > > > > >> > gun- > > > > >> > control - the killers seem to be able to get the guns anyway). I > > > > >> > also > > > > >> > don't believe that 99.99% of kids are significantly brutalised by > > > > >> > graphic games - otherwise no street in the world would be safe to > > > > >> > walk, given the fact that almost all 18-year old males in the > > > > >> > developed world have,or have had significant exposure to such > > > > >> > games. > > > > > >> > I don't know if there is any real answer to such events. Growing up > > > > >> > has always has its problems and it certainly isn't easy for kids > > > > >> > today, in our high-octane, high-pressure, consuming/consumptive > > > > >> > performance- and success-driven society. One interesting comment > > > > >> > I've > > > > >> > heard claimed that girls tend to internalise aggression (with > > > > >> > results > > > > >> > such as the repeated cutting of arms) while guys are more likely to > > > > >> > channel that argression outwards. That said, it was the amok > > > > >> > killings > > > > >> > of Brenda Ann Spencer in 1979, which inspired Bob Geldof to write, > > > > >> > "I > > > > >> > Don't Like Mondays", which maybe gives the best explanation for why > > > > >> > such things happening - the best because it just expresses rather > > > > >> > than > > > > >> > explains the unexplainable: > > > > >> > "The silicon chip inside her head > > > > >> > gets switched to overload ... " > > > > > >> > Francis- Hide quoted text - > > > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text - > > > > - Show quoted text - --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups ""Minds Eye"" group. To post to this group, send email to [email protected] To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [email protected] For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/Minds-Eye?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~---
