The population of UK is about 61 million in comparison to USA at over 300 million. So the interpretation of "Less Violent" needs visitation, Archy.
On Mar 15, 9:56 pm, archytas <[email protected]> wrote: > Michael - the short sword increased murders. It takes a bit more time > to train people to use knives and cheese-wire to kill - most find guns > easier. Most of us don't want to kill and have to be trained in it. > Cultures are vastly different, but generally it is poor men who kill > and get killed, usually young. Europe has been a very violent place > through history. Britain is much less violent in terms of murders > than the USA, yet I generally feel safer in the States (I don't work > in or visit your hot murder spots), perhaps because your cops are much > more impressive than ours and more visibly present (you have a lot > more of them per capita too). > > On 14 Mar, 16:50, Michael Berkovits <[email protected]> wrote: > > > One fact that's always interesting in these contexts is the two tribes > > studied by sociologists. I'm not going to look them up now, but I > > believe one was called the Yamamoto. Anyway, one tribe had a rate of > > violence of essentially nil, and the other had an extraordinarily high > > murder rate - probably something like 5% of all adult males were > > murdered. It was a pride-driven culture, where males asserted > > masculinity in the face of (real or perceived) insults to themselves > > or their loved ones by killing the offender. > > > Because of sexual selection, male competition is well-entrenched. But > > as the sociological tribal studies illustrate, the expression of that > > competition is not pre-ordained. Sometimes there are a lot of > > murders / duels / the like going on, and sometimes not. So there is > > some truth to the notion that social structures can decrease violence. > > But I think it is not a fair assumption that certain bugaboos of > > current society are to blame. After all, the Yamamoto didn't have > > cable tv, violent video games, and the internet, and they were way > > more violent than is modern Western society. > > > Does anyone know the stats on how much more violent Europe and the US > > are, today, as compared to say the 1800's? I'm not sure it would be > > very different - but you'd have to figure out good ways of accounting > > for whether wars count, accounting for population, for population, > > density, etc. > > > One factor that I think could reasonably be expected to have made a > > real difference is the invention of guns. It used to be that in order > > to kill someone, you had to do it in a really hands-on way. And only > > a sociopath could, say, gut someone to death, or kick and punch > > someone to death, without an extraordinarily compelling reason (e.g., > > finding them in flagrante delicto). But guns depersonalize violence. I > > would have no problem firing a gun at someone, if I had a reason - > > like, if they were robbing me on a train and I felt in danger - while > > I think I would have a real problem stabbing them. It's too... icky. > > Too evil and sadistic. > > > On Mar 14, 8:10 am, archytas <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > There have long been killing sprees like this - Foucault brought the > > > case of one to light in a paper, suggesting we listen to the account > > > directly rather than through 'psychologists'. I doubt people like > > > this can be stopped through better understanding. Perhaps we should > > > declare free range on gun collectors and then arrest the survivors? > > > Craig will undoubtedly support this position! I think some people > > > might kill in order to ensure a therapist for life. > > > > On 14 Mar, 11:41, Slip Disc <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > We can't assume that social conditions had any influence on little > > > > Tim. He's described as a reclusive with some obsessive patterns. > > > > Would he had spent more time in social settings and extra curricular > > > > activities, there might have been a more positive outcome. I've seen > > > > how wealth can sometimes turn children into a type of family bi > > > > product with the idea that money can provide all the nurturing > > > > necessary for healthy development. Tim was cold and calculated in his > > > > intent lacking both emotional and rational aspects, probably a > > > > mentally wired zombie. It is really too bad he wasn't still alive, as > > > > the results of his psychoanalysis could provide a multitude of > > > > information that might prevent future breakdowns. > > > > > On Mar 13, 11:38 am, ornamentalmind <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > "... One of the problems is conditions allowing the emotional rule > > > > > over the rational." - bruce r. > > > > > > Yes and another of the problems is the assumption that one's > > > > > 'rational' aspect can rule over the emotional. > > > > > > On Mar 13, 7:27 am, bruce ralph <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > > Animals do have a basic "fight or flight" response. When it goes > > > > > > into > > > > > > overdrive, it does result in sociopathic behaviour. We have to > > > > > > reexamine the the societal conditions that result in people "going > > > > > > off" like this. One of the problems is conditions allowing the > > > > > > emotional rule over the rational. > > > > > > > On Mar 13, 7:20 am, Don Johnson <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > > > Sigmund might say it's all to do with his relationship(or lack > > > > > > > thereof) with his Mom. Kids at that age are dealing with raging > > > > > > > hormones and other chemical changes that some find impossible to > > > > > > > handle. It is unfortunate in the extreme that his therapy didn't > > > > > > > pan > > > > > > > out. Chances are if he could have toughed it out for a few more > > > > > > > months his body and mind would have recovered. I can't imagine > > > > > > > how > > > > > > > guilty his parents must feel. It's a horrible thing. And so, so > > > > > > > sad. > > > > > > > Tragic applies. > > > > > > > > dj > > > > > > > > On Fri, Mar 13, 2009 at 4:34 AM, frantheman > > > > > > > <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > > > > Just to get the facts straight, Vam, it has since emerged that > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > report that Tim K. had stated his intention to "whip up a > > > > > > > > storm" in a > > > > > > > > chat room (Krautchan, a German clone of 4Chan) was incorrect. > > > > > > > > The > > > > > > > > police had received reports of the entry in the chat room > > > > > > > > forum, which > > > > > > > > later turned out to be false. But Rech, the interior minister, > > > > > > > > in a > > > > > > > > move sadly typical for a politician, had already taken the > > > > > > > > photo- > > > > > > > > oppportunity to go public with the news. > > > > > > > > > Far from being on Ritalin (a popular, if often questionable > > > > > > > > treatment > > > > > > > > for kids who are hyper and diagnosed as suffering from > > > > > > > > Attention- > > > > > > > > Deficit-Syndrome), as Don suggests, Tim K. is universally > > > > > > > > described as > > > > > > > > being quiet and somewhat withdrawn. Not, by any means, an over- > > > > > > > > achiever, but also not a kid who fully fits into the omega-type, > > > > > > > > weird, nerd-loser category in teenage group classification. He > > > > > > > > had > > > > > > > > recently begun therapeutic treatment for depression but had > > > > > > > > discontinued it. > > > > > > > > > Part of the psychosis which drove K. to his killing spree may > > > > > > > > have had > > > > > > > > something to do with gender issues, Slip. The vast majority of > > > > > > > > his > > > > > > > > victims in the school were female, according to the reports, > > > > > > > > and most > > > > > > > > were killed with aimed, intentional head shots (this kid was a > > > > > > > > trained > > > > > > > > shooter). This, however, would seem to argue, in my view, for > > > > > > > > traditional gender differentiation - speculatively, a > > > > > > > > generalised > > > > > > > > aggression against females because particular girls had > > > > > > > > rejected his > > > > > > > > advances. If he had been the subject of peer-group > > > > > > > > bullying/mobbing, > > > > > > > > one would have expected more alpha-jock types amongst the > > > > > > > > victims. > > > > > > > > While it might be interesting to discuss gender-related issues > > > > > > > > here, > > > > > > > > Slip, my experience is that no group is more conservative and > > > > > > > > traditional with regard to gender-differentiation than > > > > > > > > teenagers. > > > > > > > > > Francis > > > > > > > > > On 13 Mrz., 04:54, Vamadevananda <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > > >> There is something material to this discussion : The ' boy ' > > > > > > > >> had > > > > > > > >> indicated his mind, in his own words, day before committing the > > > > > > > >> mayhem. Let's hear. > > > > > > > > >> "I have weapons here and tomorrow morning I will go to my old > > > > > > > >> school > > > > > > > >> and really whip up a storm," Tim Kretschmer, 17, said in a > > > > > > > >> chat room, > > > > > > > >> according to the interior minister of the state where > > > > > > > >> Wednesday's > > > > > > > >> massacre took place. > > > > > > > > >> "I have had enough of this crummy life... Always the same. > > > > > > > >> People are > > > > > > > >> laughing at me, no-one recognises my potential... You will > > > > > > > >> hear about > > > > > > > >> me tomorrow. Make note of the name of the place: Winnenden," > > > > > > > >> the > > > > > > > >> posting said. > > > > > > > > >> "He should have just killed himself," pensioner Hildegard > > > > > > > >> Kronbach > > > > > > > >> said as she stood on the church steps. > > > > > > > > >> His father is a successful businessman who employs 150 people > > > > > > > >> at a > > > > > > > >> packaging firm, according to police, but his son found it > > > > > > > >> difficult to > > > > > > > >> fit in at school and had few friends. > > > > > > > > >> "He was simply not accepted by anyone and just sat all day in > > > > > > > >> front of > > > > > > > >> his computer," Mario, a schoolmate, told German television > > > > > > > >> station > > > > > > > >> N24. > > > > > > > > >> Reports also said he was keen on computer shooting games -- > > > > > > > >> especially > > > > > > > >> the violent "Counter-Strike" -- and had become a real-life > > > > > > > >> crack shot > > > > > > > >> at the shooting range where his father was a member. > > > > > > > > >> After leaving school last year, Kretschmer had enrolled on a > > > > > > > >> course to > > > > > > > >> train as a salesman. He regularly worked out at the gym, > > > > > > > >> belonged to a > > > > > > > >> sports club and was a keen table tennis player. > > > > > > > > >> His father owned more > > ... > > read more » --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups ""Minds Eye"" group. To post to this group, send email to [email protected] To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [email protected] For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/Minds-Eye?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~---
