You know I am saddened that someone can impose such a bias on another person's system of belief. There are good qualities and truth in every religion. I spoke with a gentleman not too long ago regarding Catholicism and Islam, we had what some would describe as a minor tiff. All the more joyable for my nature. A well thought out debate negative of offensive slander is definitely my cup of tea. Now I don't wnat to seem hypocritical as I am having hard time remaining true to my faith, but I can't help it. It's most likely biologically instilled, the defense mechanism for Islam that is. The gentleman made a point and started within me, a series of introspective views towards Catholicism. He said that a Catholic Priest will accept anyone from any faith and talk to he or she without condemning them or pursuing an initiative to convert them. I find that honorable. Acceptance by a faith that seemingly is open to advising others of different faiths. I hope that I am not wrong and was not fed a fairytale, as I don't like to disperse untrue claims. I guess I could have researched it prior to writng this post, but i don't want to lose the frame of mind that I've encountered. I am sure someone will correct me if I am wrong.
Take care and keep in mind, if you feel it necessary to insult others, it will only be viewed as ignorance. On Apr 25, 1:09 pm, iam deheretic <[email protected]> wrote: > Interesting word hypocrisy. In all organizations there is hypocrisy and > including the US Government especially if you look back at the very top of > the last administration, oh well now we only have to deal with the after > effects of it. > > Within both the roman and orthodox church the people in power are kind of > stuck there and for the most part they are pretty ordinary and very > intelligent men who's lives are controlled by others. That doesn't make them > hypocritical it just makes them stuck. sometimes very lonely too. Most of > them are very good people to be admired. I have been lucky to see thier good > works that are hidden from most. > > I do know that if they can ever escape their prison they are great to have > a cup of coffee with.. After all they have a moral and spiritual obligation > to save the heretic.. > > Allan > > > > > > On Sat, Apr 25, 2009 at 12:28 PM, e_space <[email protected]> wrote: > > > im happy with your success in this area and i dont put religion down. > > i was referring to the heirarchy of the church. there is simply too > > much hypocrisy at the top. your work is very important and, from my > > perspective, this is where the beauty of church lies, with the people, > > not those who live in mansions enforcing the laws as they see them. > > keep up the good work! :-) > > > On Apr 25, 2:14 am, iam deheretic <[email protected]> wrote: > > > You know e-space me and the catholic church have our differences, they > > are > > > theological and yes I am a heretic, When you talk about wealth, Francis > > is > > > right most of it is wealth you just can not dispose of most of it is > > peoples > > > gifts honoring God, one of the modern one a person needs to look at the > > > Washington cathedral look who was hired to build it,, the unemployed > > trained > > > in the skills they needed to know and then given a job for the rest of > > their > > > life, Those were not people that were just out of work, they were the > > > unemployable, > > > I personally have been involved in projects trying to help the poor earn > > a > > > living in 3rd world and have lost a small fortune and still do. But poor > > > people can feed their families with pride. But the greatest thing that > > ever > > > happened is when the letter came.. It read dear Allan We succeeded in > > > finding a cure for leprosy thank you may God bless Fr. C > > > > Religion is not about wealth but learning to serve our fellow man. > > > > disagreements and heretic papers in hand I will stand shoulder to > > shoulder > > > with the RC or Orthodox Church > > > > Allan > > > > On Fri, Apr 24, 2009 at 10:28 PM, e_space <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > i bow to your intimate knowledge on this subject and i agree to > > > > generalization. i guess i was just trying to make a point. im not sure > > > > slopping thinking was involved, maybe less than stellar research. > > > > thanks for the clarifications... > > > > > On Apr 24, 4:02 pm, frantheman <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > On 24 Apr., 12:15, e_space <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > > analyzing religion from an heirarchy point of view, i see religious > > > > > > leaders as quite evil. religion is often used to control people > > > > > > through fear and intimidation, not love and guidance. the roman > > > > > > catholic religion for example, is the richest 'corporation' in the > > > > > > world, yet its converts are starving to death and dying of aids > > > > > > because they cant use contraception. many of the priests are > > > > > > pedeophiles who have been sheltered and moved around from one > > church > > > > > > to the other when scandals were about to break out. they have been > > > > > > associated with the mafia and murder and will not let females be > > > > > > priests. they live in mansions that are FAR beyond any dream home > > you > > > > > > and i would imagine, have michael angelo on the ceiling, walk > > around > > > > > > with massive crowns on their heads and gold jewelry that makes a > > > > > > rappers bling look like a cracker jack toy. jesus supposedly said, > > > > > > 'give up your riches and follow me'. i guess somewhere down the > > road, > > > > > > religious leaders sorta overlooked this admonition. i have nothing > > > > > > against those who go to church, and if it brings them happiness, > > > > > > great. just not my cup of tea... > > > > > > There is a great deal of truth in what you write here, e, but also > > > > > large dollops of generalisation, inaccuracy and sloppy thinking > > which, > > > > > in my view, serve only to weaken your argument. > > > > > > Those who know me better here are well aware of my extremely critical > > > > > position viz a viz the RC Church. Nonetheless, I feel I must clarify > > > > > some of the points you allude to. > > > > > > Firstly, the "roman catholic religion" is not a "corporation" of any > > > > > kind, but rather a designation for over a billion adherents world- > > > > > wide, the vast majority of whom voluntarily associate themselves with > > > > > this belief, which is internally organised, according to its own > > > > > rules, as a "church". While you and I might regard the official RC > > > > > position on contraception, population control and HIV-AIDS as > > > > > extremely backward, irrational and regrettable, I must point out that > > > > > there is no way the RC Church can force its adherents to follow its > > > > > teachings, apart from the "moral" authority accorded to it by many of > > > > > those adherents. > > > > > > The wealth of the RC Church is a difficult subject to discuss, as its > > > > > assets are legally in the hands of thousands of distinct > > organisations > > > > > and groups, some of which are quite wealthy, some of which are very > > > > > poor. The administrative centre of the Church, the Vatican City, is > > an > > > > > internationally recognised independent country, with its own laws, > > > > > maintaining formal diplomatic contacts with most countries in the > > > > > world. The present position of this entity is the result of 1700 > > years > > > > > of historical development. Much of its wealth is in the form of real > > > > > estate and artistic treasures, a lot of which (including the Sistine > > > > > Chapel - which I presume is what you meant with "michael angelo [sic] > > > > > on the ceiling") is open to public viewing for a modest fee - used to > > > > > maintain the substance of the area generally known as the "Vatican > > > > > Museum." The value of it all is priceless, but also practically > > > > > useless, since I know of no way in which it could be justly converted > > > > > into liquid assets (would selling it to Bill Gates or Roman > > Abramovich > > > > > - preuming they wanted to buy - really make the world better?). A > > > > > parallel example would be the Potala Palace in Lhasa (today > > > > > nationalised by the Chinese and turned into a museum) which includes > > > > > the tomb of the 13th. Dalai Lama, reportedly containing priceless > > > > > jewels and a ton of gold. > > > > > > While the wearing of crowns remains a ritual/liturgical tradition in > > > > > the Orthodox Churches (particularly that of Russia) it has never been > > > > > a general part of RC liturgy and, in fact, even the Roman popes have > > > > > not worn the (till then) traditional tiara for the past fifty years. > > > > > > The lack of openness and protection by many instances of Church > > > > > authority of many priests who have been accused of abusing children > > is > > > > > a scandal of horrific proportions. While not in any way comparable to > > > > > the suffering of the thousands of victims, there are also many > > > > > thousands priests, sisters, brothers and lay workers who are > > suffering > > > > > from the fall-out and many of them are struggling against corrupt and > > > > > encrusted structures within the organisation. My only regret about my > > > > > personal departure from the said organisation is the feeling I still > > > > > sometimes have that I was leaving a lot of honest, good friends to > > > > > carry on their struggle without me. > > > > > > Francis- Hide quoted text - > > > > > > - Show quoted text - > > > > -- > > > ( > > > ) > > > I_D Allan- Hide quoted text - > > > > - Show quoted text - > > -- > ( > ) > I_D Allan- Hide quoted text - > > - Show quoted text - --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups ""Minds Eye"" group. To post to this group, send email to [email protected] To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [email protected] For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/Minds-Eye?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~---
