Yes- we do comply with the choices our government makes- we are forced to- through taxation and laws so there is no easy moral excuse for anyone. I really fail to see much difference today from the ancient tax collectors. The irony is that most feel the USA made a fresh start from the British Empire when we revolted.//I am up to the Middle Ages after 300 pages of reading, so be forewarned! :-)
On Mar 23, 10:42 am, ornamentalmind <[email protected]> wrote: > Without doing a lot of research, one of the first return from god > google produced > this:http://www.nytimes.com/2009/05/28/health/policy/28massachusetts.html?... > > In part, it says “Despite a weakening economy, Massachusetts continued > to measure gains in the share of residents who reported having a > steady source of health care in 2008, its second year of near- > universal coverage, a new study has found. > > But the annual survey, taken each fall since 2006, also raised red > flags regarding the ability of residents to actually use that care, > with growing numbers saying they could not afford needed treatments > and many reporting shortages of primary care physicians…” > > At least, according > tohttp://www.nytimes.com/2009/05/28/health/policy/28massachusetts.html?... > it does. > > According to another study: “The uninsured are more likely to be > hospitalized for an avoidable condition. “Nationally, the uninsured > are 30 to 50 percent more likely to be hospitalized for an avoidable > condition, with the average cost of an avoidable hospital stayed > estimated to be about $3,300” Source: “Hidden Costs, Values Lost: > Uninsurance in America,” Institute of Medicine, June 2003.” > > The examples are legion and vary greatly from state to state. Also, > from socioeconomic class to socioeconomic class…which, of course, is > what those with good jobs or good inheritances want. > > You asked a few questions rigsy like “What did they leave behind?”. > For one, freedom. Clearly they (slaves) weren’t the ‘fittest’ > according to some people, which was all the rage when it came to self > righteous worship of being an Arian. As to immigrants, surely those > you mention left behind nothing worse than what was imposed upon them. > > You also ask “The fact that we have an obesity and std problem should > be > laid on whose doorstep?” Well, the former can mainly be laid at the > feet of big corporation marketing and the bottom line kind of morality > it produces. What is added to food stuffs in the USA is the cause and > it is no accident that what is added is addictive in many ways. Again, > to blame elsewhere blames the victim. > > As to the latter, I’d say mostly puritanical thinking and those who > spread it…fundamentalists included today. Not allowing sex education > and keeping the population ignorant is a direct result of such blind > belief systems. And, the result of ignorance is std’s. > > “What role is expected of parents in providing > a healthy diet and lifestyle?” > > For those who are educated, not ignorant, and who have the means to > provide a healthy diet “and lifestyle”, much. Sadly, for many reasons, > most parents are ignorant in such areas and most do not have the means > to provide good diets and ‘lifestyles’. You, luckily appear to be an > exception. > > “What are the implications of toxins in > the enviornment and food supply and isn't that a trade society > makes?” > > Uhhh, a ‘trade society makes?’???!!! No, it isn’t…at least not if one > assumes any actual choice in such a tradeoff. We’ve discussed such > things a lot here. I’m a member of society. I have *never* voted to > have toxins in the environment nor have I ever requested toxins in the > food supply. In fact, for decades, I’ve been fighting against such > things. So, I had no trade to make. And, no, I didn’t “vote” with my > pocketbook either. > > “War has the last laugh on bodies not to mention fields and > water supplies poisoned with spent uranium to haunt the survivors. Or > Agent Orange.” > > Such a strange comment. We in the USA haven’t had to deal with such a > thing for a long time, at least not the citizens. And, today, what > with an all ‘volunteer’ military (socioeconomic class warfare aside), > those who go ‘over there’ have “decided” to take such risks. Now, when > it comes to the countries the US has invaded, those people do have to > worry about such things. Oh, I was being glib about members of the US > military deciding to be poisoned by enlisting. Again, a false choice… > sadly. > > On Mar 23, 3:52 am, rigsy03 <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > It was survival of the fittest whether talking about the transport of > > African slaves or the immigrants working the iron and coal mines or > > the homesteaders living in sod houses. What had they left behind?//You > > might want to look into the influence that speciality medicine has had > > upon healthcare for all income classes. Generally, ER accepts all > > comers.// The fact that we have an obesity and std problem should be > > laid on whose doorstep? What role is expected of parents in providing > > a healthy diet and lifestyle? What are the implications of toxins in > > the enviornment and food supply and isn't that a trade society > > makes?// War has the last laugh on bodies not to mention fields and > > water supplies poisoned with spent uranium to haunt the survivors. Or > > Agent Orange. > > > On Mar 23, 1:43 am, ornamentalmind <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > When it comes to ‘assets’, perhaps for some, life itself could be seen > > > as being same. However, for the poor, health and will being just may > > > not be possible in a system as draconian as the …what should we call > > > it?...it isn’t a ‘health care’ system today…an insurance-hospital for > > > profit system perhaps?...is today. Of course, the term ‘insurance’ has > > > become conflated with ‘healthcare’. They *are* quite different things. > > > Countless other models today can confirm this. > > > > And, IF one is to be treated in all ways based on how much money one > > > has, that about matches reality today, no? My guess Don, is that you > > > receive, proportionately, *much* better health care than you should… > > > compared say to Bill Gates. Perhaps we should change the law and give > > > you worse care? > > > > Sadly, the youth of today have no idea how healthcare was dispensed > > > say, in the 40s and 50s. As the US was reaching its zenith in many > > > ways, people didn’t have to worry about healthcare. There was an > > > understanding, as there is in almost every civilized western > > > industrialized country, that health care *is* a right…similar to food > > > and shelter. It isn’t even debated! > > > > Somehow, avarice became the watchword for the US rather than notions > > > like freedom, egalitarianism, democracy, compassion, love etc. There > > > is a reason that greed is seen as a poison/sin in almost every > > > theology on the planet…it poisons the human psyche…along with > > > everything that particular psyche touches. > > > > On Mar 22, 10:22 pm, Don Johnson <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > I see insurance as what it is and should be. Something to protect > > > > your assets should something catastrophic befall you. Such as disease > > > > or illness or fire or flood. If you have no assets(say, if you're > > > > dirt poor) ya don't need no stinkin' insurance. That's the way I've > > > > always seen it. I really don't get how people see something as a > > > > right that is really nothing of the sort. That doesn't mean that we > > > > should ignore the poor that are sick but it DOES mean they certainly > > > > don't deserve the same level of care as those of us who can afford > > > > better care. > > > > > I was in court today to take care of some business. I was there for 2 > > > > and a half hours. I saved roughly 250 dollars by seeing the judge > > > > and not just paying my tickets. You sit in pews until the row ahead > > > > of you is empty and then your row moves up one row. Cell phones > > > > turned off and nobody talking to each other. I sat there bored stiff > > > > thinking "yeah, in a few years, this is what it will be like at the > > > > doctors office." I was aching to pop off and say it out loud but was > > > > scared the judge would hear me. All these big city judges are > > > > bleeding heart liberals. Last thing I wanted to do was piss off the > > > > judge. > > > > > Got me to thinking seeing all these guys and dolls sitting there bored > > > > out of their minds. They should open up kiosks with hot dogs and > > > > jewelry and maybe a bar with mixed drinks and sodas while you wait. > > > > Maybe a bank of those cool poker slot machines. We'd all be a little > > > > less bored the the city could make a little more profit. Ooops. > > > > There's the P word. > > > > > dj > > > > > On Mon, Mar 22, 2010 at 2:17 AM, iam deheretic <[email protected]> > > > > wrote: > > > > > Don You are a Cop and a proud job.. but when they over look the > > > > > corruption > > > > > and miss information to prevent a bill from passing it is a sad > > > > > day.. My > > > > > question to you is this.. when policies of insurance companies make > > > > > in the > > > > > name of freedom and profit are the board of directors and the top > > > > > corporate > > > > > executives held accountable for the murders they they with their > > > > > policies > > > > > committed? > > > > > Allan > > > > > > On Sun, Mar 21, 2010 at 9:28 PM, Don Johnson <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > >> Greetings comrades! Another great leap towards loss of personal and > > > > >> financial freedom. We're going so Euro pretty soon I'm going to stop > > > > >> taking a shower every day and give up on deodorant. Maybe try some > > > > >> warm beer as well just for solidarity. > > > > > >> Seriously, I'm a bit sad today. One bright spot was seeing my > > > > >> brother > > > > >> at the protest at the WH. He's there for a class but is free this > > > > >> weekend to play tourist. He called me and parked himself by the fox > > > > >> news camera and I finally spotted him. Looking bored. His answer to > > > > >> what he thinks of the HC bill is, "I don't know, I haven't read it." > > > > >> Yeah, he voted for Obama. I tried to get him to start a chant, > > > > >> "Free- > > > > >> Dom! Free-Dom!" but he wouldn't do it. Wussy. > > > > > >> They have more votes then they need now. Slaughter House Rules. > > > > >> Books will be written about this travesty of process and the fraud > > > > >> being perpetrated by our Congressmen. > > > > > >> Deficit > > ... > > read more »- Hide quoted text - > > - Show quoted text - -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups ""Minds Eye"" group. To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [email protected]. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/minds-eye?hl=en.
