Hello everybody.. :) On Wed, Oct 26, 2011 at 3:09 PM, archytas <[email protected]> wrote:
> I tend to like the idea too Allan - one way to the positive is to do. > In the more intellectual sense, getting to the positive (which has > many definitions) usually means stripping away loads of dross. In the > process one usually finds the dross is cherished and part of the > reason nothing can ever get done! > > One aspect of all the nonsense of current economic utterings that > makes me laugh at the moment (or is it cry?) is the idea of raising > pension age in order to save money - this is full of assumptions that > there re jobs to do, that clinging to one doesn't prevent someone else > doing it and so on. > > On Oct 25, 8:19 am, Allan H <[email protected]> wrote: > > Lol do I start with you Gabby? I would not want to push people. If they > > wanted to contribute it would be great. A larger starting point, but > > nothing beyond their means though. > > > > I can not help but wonder how it will evolve, I am sure it will be > > interesting, > > Allan > > On Oct 25, 2011 9:03 AM, "gabbydott" <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I quite like your idea, Allan. You've got my vote to keep on trying to > > > persuade the others to see if they have some 100 Euros to spare. > > > > > On Tue, Oct 25, 2011 at 7:58 AM, Allan H <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > >> I know Neil it is but a pittance that is what so funny about it.. I > > >> think the problem lies in the short term,, Maybe that is what it > should > > >> be called is the pittance fund.. > > >> Money is a problem because it is guided by people who's interests is > self > > >> centered. creating the pittance fund,, then we have the time and > > >> possibility to get it to grow.. and provide the long term guidance to > make > > >> it successful over 500 plus years where it would reach the size.. at > witch > > >> time the pittance fund would be as powerful or more powerful than the > other > > >> markets.. it takes for sight.. > > >> What I am saying by putting up my 100 Euro is that our combined wisdom > > >> and knowledge exceeds that of the normal public. it would be chance > to put > > >> our theories into practice.. Even if we fail we have tried and can not > be > > >> faulted for that.. but I do not think that will happen,, > > >> Allan > > > > >> On Tue, Oct 25, 2011 at 2:54 AM, archytas <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > >>> If you do any radical thinking at all you should at least guess money > > >>> may be as much of a problem as an asset Allan. The money in our > > >>> pockets, under your mattress and in current accounts is dwarfed by > the > > >>> same currency in the derivatives and other shadow markets. What we > > >>> should focus on is how we can build through effort and organisation. > > > > >>> On Oct 25, 12:39 am, Vam <[email protected]> wrote: > > >>> > Find out ( Chris ? ) what it takes to register a formal NGO Trust > > >>> > ( with Tax benefits and Donations tax-exempt ) operating a news - > > >>> > magazine website ... > > > > >>> > WE THE PEOPLE : ALTERNATE NEWS, RECLAIMING EFFORTS & REDEFINED > > >>> > THOUGHTS FROM AROUND THE WORLD... > > > > >>> > We then can pool in people centered news, efforts at reclaiming our > > >>> > lives and freedoms, and path breaking thoughts from all over the > world > > >>> > in diverse fields such as science, medicine, sociology, psychology, > > >>> > economics, management, public service, governance, > entrepreneurship... > > >>> > along lines of " Global Voices "... overseen by a crack Editorial > > >>> > Team. > > > > >>> > We may then perhaps know what it would take... what more would have > to > > >>> > be scrounged and how... > > > > >>> > On Oct 24, 10:35 pm, Allan H <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > >>> > > it is because it is compounded ,, i figured it at > > >>> > > annual interest payment.. if you take your principle and > > >>> immediately add > > >>> > > the interest you have increased your principle by that amount.. > a > > >>> hundred > > >>> > > euro becomes 104 Euro.. > > > > >>> > > to demonstrate the effect if you are paying off the mortgage on > > >>> your > > >>> > > house in say 15 years,, making a monthly payment,, if you > split > > >>> the > > >>> > > payment in half paying the loan 1/2 on the 1st and the other 1/2 > on > > >>> the > > >>> > > 15th.. remember you are paying exactly the same amount each > month,, > > >>> > > instead of taking 15 years to pay the loan it will take you only > 13 > > >>> 1/2 > > >>> > > years to pay it back.. > > > > >>> > > If your payment was say $1,000. (no Euro sign) you would be > saving > > >>> your > > >>> > > self $18,000. in payments.. not a bad piece of pocket change you > > >>> ask me.. > > > > >>> > > Does that help you understand they power of money if used > > >>> intelligently and > > >>> > > effectively? > > >>> > > Allan > > > > >>> > > RP could you see a company that simply made house payments?? > they > > >>> pay you > > >>> > > once a month and you pay the Bankster 2X a month?? > > > > >>> > > On Mon, Oct 24, 2011 at 7:19 PM, RP Singh <[email protected]> > wrote: > > >>> > > > Again , Allan , I don't see how 100 euros grow so > astronomically > > >>> at a > > >>> > > > simple rate of interest of 4% ? > > > > >>> > > > On Mon, Oct 24, 2011 at 8:40 PM, Allan H <[email protected] > > > > >>> wrote: > > >>> > > > > Okay I have been doing a lot of thinking ... well I am sure > > >>> there are > > >>> > > > > enough good ideas that can radically change the world.. > Oddly I > > >>> really > > >>> > > > do > > >>> > > > > not think it will take massive amounts,, but it will take > some > > >>> funds > > >>> > > > and I > > >>> > > > > have a lot of faith in our group to be able to develop > workable > > >>> ideas.. > > >>> > > > > Now to put my money with my mouth is even though I do not > have > > >>> massive > > >>> > > > > amounts of money I can easily contribute 100 Euro to commit > to > > >>> a fund to > > >>> > > > > change the world.. I do not know if others are willing to > > >>> develop a > > >>> > > > world > > >>> > > > > improvement fund. as I know this discussion will go one for > > >>> years after > > >>> > > > we > > >>> > > > > are gone I could for see it still in existence 500 onward.. > > >>> > > > > there needs to be unchangeable able rules like > > >>> > > > > The principle can not be spent.. > > >>> > > > > No more than 20 % of the income can be spent on fund > > >>> administration. > > >>> > > > > 20 % of the income generated must be added to the principle > > >>> every year, > > >>> > > > (or > > >>> > > > > more often) > > >>> > > > > How the 60 % well .. some types of projects just do not make > > >>> nor are > > >>> > > > meant > > >>> > > > > to make money just for the improvement of society some > where.. > > >>> > > > > Now there is even a small amount of money available. > > >>> > > > > We need to discuss how to set it up maybe I have it all > > >>> confused,, > > >>> > > > anyways > > >>> > > > > I will send the money to where it is decided to set up the > > >>> funds,, > > >>> > > > There is > > >>> > > > > one hundred Euro available sitting in a tin behind me.. If > > >>> others do > > >>> > > > > contribute it should be in amounts of their own currency and > to > > >>> an amount > > >>> > > > > that will not cause harm to them or thier families... as once > > >>> the money > > >>> > > > is > > >>> > > > > gone it is gone and can not be expect to have it returned. > > >>> > > > > If we set it up and develop it correctly in five hundred > years > > >>> that 100 > > >>> > > > > Euros will have a value if it grows at a simple 4% of: > > >>> > > > > 32,860,158,157.oo Euro > > >>> > > > > 32 billion is an amount that can have some on going effects > to > > >>> improve > > >>> > > > > society.. It is called putting your money where your mouth > is.. > > >>> The > > >>> > > > > question is who wants to run it.. I am not able to Vam? > Molly? > > >>> Neil? > > >>> > > > Chris? > > >>> > > > > Rigsy? hmmm > > >>> > > > > Allan > > > > >>> > > > > Because > > > > >>> > > > > On Mon, Oct 24, 2011 at 11:57 AM, Vam <[email protected] > > > > >>> wrote: > > > > >>> > > > >> Ah, Rigs... that isn't as tragic... as the fact that Cheats > are > > >>> Elites > > >>> > > > >> and Elites are Thieves ! > > > > >>> > > > >> On Oct 24, 2:23 pm, rigsy03 <[email protected]> wrote: > > >>> > > > >> > Machines/technology are replacing human labor. Children > might > > >>> do > > >>> > > > >> > better being educated via computer and leave socialization > to > > >>> play > > >>> > > > >> > groups and sports. The military can effect as much damage > via > > >>> remote > > >>> > > > >> > control. But- will women return to being stay-at-home > > >>> moms/homemakers > > >>> > > > >> > thus freeing up what jobs remain for the men? I doubt it - > it > > >>> has > > >>> > > > >> > become an ego/security matter for Western women. There > will > > >>> always be > > >>> > > > >> > cheats and thieves, Archytas, who cause as much monetary > > >>> losses as the > > >>> > > > >> > "elites"- it's all relative, depending on the number of > zeros. > > > > >>> > > > >> > On Oct 24, 1:37 am, archytas <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > >>> > > > >> > > There was philosophy once called logical positivism. > > >>> \\it's people > > >>> > > > >> > > were well-intentioned, like Russell and Carnap. If you > > >>> have a few > > >>> > > > >> > > hours to spare I could explain its basics - in the end > it > > >>> got so > > >>> > > > >> > > concerned with words they were all that was left. > > >>> Strangely it was > > >>> > > > >> > > accused of being crude in its use of brute fact. > > > > >>> > > > >> > > The problem as I see it is that we want democracy but > have > > >>> not > > >>> > > > found a > > >>> > > > >> > > way to accept its biggest flaw - that of decisions made > > >>> through the > > >>> > > > >> > > sway of ignorance, and further problems with the > corruption > > >>> of > > >>> > > > >> > > representatives. Attempts at a fix of this in > perfection > > >>> are doomed > > >>> > > > >> > > or the equivalent of fiddling while Rome burns. > > > > >>> > > > >> > > One might try to produce communication free of ideology > and > > >>> this let > > >>> > > > >> > > Reason alone have power (Habermas) - but as far as I can > > >>> see this > > >>> > > > >> > > never works - and Habermas only suggests his 'ideal > speech > > >>> > > > situation' > > >>> > > > >> > > as an ideal type (following Weber). > > > > >>> > > > >> > > The best positive I can reach is that we could change > our > > >>> material > > >>> > > > >> > > conditions to produce less discontent. To get to an > > >>> understanding > > >>> > > > of > > >>> > > > >> > > this we need to agree on some basic facts - and the move > > >>> towards > > >>> > > > these > > >>> > > > >> > > is critical. People as old as Orn and myself can > remember > > >>> when it > > >>> > > > was > > >>> > > > >> > > possible for most in the West to get somewhere near this > > >>> because > > >>> > > > there > > >>> > > > >> > > were plenty of well paid jobs about. Oversimplifying a > lot > > >>> this is > > >>> > > > >> > > not now the case and we need to establish what the new > > >>> conditions > > >>> > > > are. > > > > >>> > > > >> > > Productivity is vastly enhanced from the times in which > our > > >>> work > > >>> > > > >> > > ethics arose. My guess is we could get by quite nicely > on > > >>> a 30hr > > >>> > > > >> > > working week and a 40 week year with > > > > ... > > > > read more ยป
