Thanks Allan :) On Wed, Oct 26, 2011 at 6:45 PM, Allan H <[email protected]> wrote:
> Oh yeah Richard,, unfortunately politics is heavily influnced > by corporate bribery and wealthy individuals who leave me wondering if they > care about their money or the people they are supposed to care for and look > after there interest. > Politicians seem to have a creed that was pointed out earlier by a member > of this group. Politicians seem to say one thing then do something entirely > different. > Allan > > On Wed, Oct 26, 2011 at 12:25 PM, richard blay <[email protected]>wrote: > >> Perfectly, Allan, on the part of the politicians. until part of the >> solution is done, which is your idea on board, the situation will ever >> remain as it is...even worse. >> >> On 10/26/11, Allan H <[email protected]> wrote: >> > Politicians have truths that apply to everyone else except them. and >> they >> > never feel the sting of the whip. >> > I know over here the politicians doubled their salaries just before >> > the financial crash, not surprising though the pay raise was never >> removed >> > the extra income, so they live at twice the wage while no pay raises >> not >> > even cost of living for public employees like fire department , Police >> > people or others.. >> > >> > I am sure that if you look the same thing has happened in your country >> no >> > matter which one it is.. Politicians seem to be acting on their own >> > behalf and those of their rich friends.. >> > >> > Maybe all politicians should be put on minimum wage with no assistance >> > from friend or family.. with only services of public >> > assistance available to them and their family. I do know something >> needs >> > to be done to bring this political privilege under control.. maybe a >> > better way to put it is get control of the out right bribery. >> > Allan >> > >> > On Wed, Oct 26, 2011 at 10:09 AM, archytas <[email protected]> wrote: >> > >> >> I tend to like the idea too Allan - one way to the positive is to do. >> >> In the more intellectual sense, getting to the positive (which has >> >> many definitions) usually means stripping away loads of dross. In the >> >> process one usually finds the dross is cherished and part of the >> >> reason nothing can ever get done! >> >> >> >> One aspect of all the nonsense of current economic utterings that >> >> makes me laugh at the moment (or is it cry?) is the idea of raising >> >> pension age in order to save money - this is full of assumptions that >> >> there re jobs to do, that clinging to one doesn't prevent someone else >> >> doing it and so on. >> >> >> >> On Oct 25, 8:19 am, Allan H <[email protected]> wrote: >> >> > Lol do I start with you Gabby? I would not want to push people. If >> they >> >> > wanted to contribute it would be great. A larger starting point, but >> >> > nothing beyond their means though. >> >> > >> >> > I can not help but wonder how it will evolve, I am sure it will be >> >> > interesting, >> >> > Allan >> >> > On Oct 25, 2011 9:03 AM, "gabbydott" <[email protected]> wrote: >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > > I quite like your idea, Allan. You've got my vote to keep on trying >> to >> >> > > persuade the others to see if they have some 100 Euros to spare. >> >> > >> >> > > On Tue, Oct 25, 2011 at 7:58 AM, Allan H <[email protected]> >> wrote: >> >> > >> >> > >> I know Neil it is but a pittance that is what so funny about >> it.. >> >> > >> I >> >> > >> think the problem lies in the short term,, Maybe that is what it >> >> should >> >> > >> be called is the pittance fund.. >> >> > >> Money is a problem because it is guided by people who's interests >> is >> >> self >> >> > >> centered. creating the pittance fund,, then we have the time and >> >> > >> possibility to get it to grow.. and provide the long term >> guidance >> >> to make >> >> > >> it successful over 500 plus years where it would reach the size.. >> at >> >> witch >> >> > >> time the pittance fund would be as powerful or more powerful than >> the >> >> other >> >> > >> markets.. it takes for sight.. >> >> > >> What I am saying by putting up my 100 Euro is that our combined >> >> > >> wisdom >> >> > >> and knowledge exceeds that of the normal public. it would be >> chance >> >> to put >> >> > >> our theories into practice.. Even if we fail we have tried and can >> >> not be >> >> > >> faulted for that.. but I do not think that will happen,, >> >> > >> Allan >> >> > >> >> > >> On Tue, Oct 25, 2011 at 2:54 AM, archytas <[email protected]> >> wrote: >> >> > >> >> > >>> If you do any radical thinking at all you should at least guess >> >> > >>> money >> >> > >>> may be as much of a problem as an asset Allan. The money in our >> >> > >>> pockets, under your mattress and in current accounts is dwarfed >> by >> >> the >> >> > >>> same currency in the derivatives and other shadow markets. What >> we >> >> > >>> should focus on is how we can build through effort and >> organisation. >> >> > >> >> > >>> On Oct 25, 12:39 am, Vam <[email protected]> wrote: >> >> > >>> > Find out ( Chris ? ) what it takes to register a formal NGO >> Trust >> >> > >>> > ( with Tax benefits and Donations tax-exempt ) operating a news >> - >> >> > >>> > magazine website ... >> >> > >> >> > >>> > WE THE PEOPLE : ALTERNATE NEWS, RECLAIMING EFFORTS & REDEFINED >> >> > >>> > THOUGHTS FROM AROUND THE WORLD... >> >> > >> >> > >>> > We then can pool in people centered news, efforts at reclaiming >> >> > >>> > our >> >> > >>> > lives and freedoms, and path breaking thoughts from all over >> the >> >> world >> >> > >>> > in diverse fields such as science, medicine, sociology, >> >> > >>> > psychology, >> >> > >>> > economics, management, public service, governance, >> >> entrepreneurship... >> >> > >>> > along lines of " Global Voices "... overseen by a crack >> Editorial >> >> > >>> > Team. >> >> > >> >> > >>> > We may then perhaps know what it would take... what more would >> >> have to >> >> > >>> > be scrounged and how... >> >> > >> >> > >>> > On Oct 24, 10:35 pm, Allan H <[email protected]> wrote: >> >> > >> >> > >>> > > it is because it is compounded ,, i figured it at >> >> > >>> > > annual interest payment.. if you take your principle and >> >> > >>> immediately add >> >> > >>> > > the interest you have increased your principle by that >> amount.. >> >> a >> >> > >>> hundred >> >> > >>> > > euro becomes 104 Euro.. >> >> > >> >> > >>> > > to demonstrate the effect if you are paying off the >> mortgage >> >> > >>> > > on >> >> > >>> your >> >> > >>> > > house in say 15 years,, making a monthly payment,, if you >> >> split >> >> > >>> the >> >> > >>> > > payment in half paying the loan 1/2 on the 1st and the other >> 1/2 >> >> on >> >> > >>> the >> >> > >>> > > 15th.. remember you are paying exactly the same amount each >> >> month,, >> >> > >>> > > instead of taking 15 years to pay the loan it will take you >> >> only 13 >> >> > >>> 1/2 >> >> > >>> > > years to pay it back.. >> >> > >> >> > >>> > > If your payment was say $1,000. (no Euro sign) you would be >> >> saving >> >> > >>> your >> >> > >>> > > self $18,000. in payments.. not a bad piece of pocket change >> >> > >>> > > you >> >> > >>> ask me.. >> >> > >> >> > >>> > > Does that help you understand they power of money if used >> >> > >>> intelligently and >> >> > >>> > > effectively? >> >> > >>> > > Allan >> >> > >> >> > >>> > > RP could you see a company that simply made house payments?? >> >> they >> >> > >>> pay you >> >> > >>> > > once a month and you pay the Bankster 2X a month?? >> >> > >> >> > >>> > > On Mon, Oct 24, 2011 at 7:19 PM, RP Singh <[email protected]> >> >> wrote: >> >> > >>> > > > Again , Allan , I don't see how 100 euros grow so >> >> astronomically >> >> > >>> at a >> >> > >>> > > > simple rate of interest of 4% ? >> >> > >> >> > >>> > > > On Mon, Oct 24, 2011 at 8:40 PM, Allan H < >> [email protected] >> >> > >> >> > >>> wrote: >> >> > >>> > > > > Okay I have been doing a lot of thinking ... well I am >> sure >> >> > >>> there are >> >> > >>> > > > > enough good ideas that can radically change the world.. >> >> Oddly I >> >> > >>> really >> >> > >>> > > > do >> >> > >>> > > > > not think it will take massive amounts,, but it will >> take >> >> some >> >> > >>> funds >> >> > >>> > > > and I >> >> > >>> > > > > have a lot of faith in our group to be able to develop >> >> workable >> >> > >>> ideas.. >> >> > >>> > > > > Now to put my money with my mouth is even though I do not >> >> have >> >> > >>> massive >> >> > >>> > > > > amounts of money I can easily contribute 100 Euro to >> commit >> >> to >> >> > >>> a fund to >> >> > >>> > > > > change the world.. I do not know if others are willing >> to >> >> > >>> develop a >> >> > >>> > > > world >> >> > >>> > > > > improvement fund. as I know this discussion will go one >> for >> >> > >>> years after >> >> > >>> > > > we >> >> > >>> > > > > are gone I could for see it still in existence 500 >> >> > >>> > > > > onward.. >> >> > >>> > > > > there needs to be unchangeable able rules like >> >> > >>> > > > > The principle can not be spent.. >> >> > >>> > > > > No more than 20 % of the income can be spent on fund >> >> > >>> administration. >> >> > >>> > > > > 20 % of the income generated must be added to the >> principle >> >> > >>> every year, >> >> > >>> > > > (or >> >> > >>> > > > > more often) >> >> > >>> > > > > How the 60 % well .. some types of projects just do not >> make >> >> > >>> nor are >> >> > >>> > > > meant >> >> > >>> > > > > to make money just for the improvement of society some >> >> where.. >> >> > >>> > > > > Now there is even a small amount of money available. >> >> > >>> > > > > We need to discuss how to set it up maybe I have it all >> >> > >>> confused,, >> >> > >>> > > > anyways >> >> > >>> > > > > I will send the money to where it is decided to set up >> the >> >> > >>> funds,, >> >> > >>> > > > There is >> >> > >>> > > > > one hundred Euro available sitting in a tin behind me.. >> If >> >> > >>> others do >> >> > >>> > > > > contribute it should be in amounts of their own currency >> and >> >> to >> >> > >>> an amount >> >> > >>> > > > > that will not cause harm to them or thier families... as >> >> > >>> > > > > once >> >> > >>> the money >> >> > >>> > > > is >> >> > >>> > > > > gone it is gone and can not be expect to have it >> returned. >> >> > >>> > > > > If we set it up and develop it correctly in five hundred >> >> years >> >> > >>> that 100 >> >> > >>> > > > > Euros will have a value if it grows at a simple 4% of: >> >> > >>> > > > > 32,860,158,157.oo Euro >> >> > >>> > > > > 32 billion is an amount that can have some on going >> effects >> >> to >> >> > >>> improve >> >> > >>> > > > > society.. It is called putting your money where your >> mouth >> >> is.. >> >> > >>> The >> >> > >>> > > > > question is who wants to run it.. I am not able to Vam? >> >> Molly? >> >> > >>> Neil? >> >> > >>> > > > Chris? >> >> > >>> > > > > Rigsy? hmmm >> >> > >>> > > > > Allan >> >> > >> >> > >>> > > > > Because >> >> > >> >> > >>> > > > > On Mon, Oct 24, 2011 at 11:57 AM, Vam < >> [email protected] >> >> > >> >> > >>> wrote: >> >> > >> >> > >>> > > > >> Ah, Rigs... that isn't as tragic... as the fact that >> Cheats >> >> are >> >> > >>> Elites >> >> > >>> > > > >> and Elites are Thieves ! >> >> > >> >> > >>> > > > >> On Oct 24, 2:23 pm, rigsy03 <[email protected]> wrote: >> >> > >>> > > > >> > Machines/technology are replacing human labor. >> Children >> >> might >> >> > >>> do >> >> > >>> > > > >> > better being educated via computer and leave >> >> socialization to >> >> > >>> play >> >> > >>> > > > >> > groups and sports. The military can effect as much >> damage >> >> via >> >> > >>> remote >> >> > >>> > > > >> > control. But- will women return to being stay-at-home >> >> > >>> moms/homemakers >> >> > >>> > > > >> > thus freeing up what jobs remain for the men? I doubt >> it >> >> - it >> >> > >>> has >> >> > >>> > > > >> > become an ego/security matter for Western women. There >> >> will >> >> > >>> always be >> >> > >>> > > > >> > cheats and thieves, Archytas, who cause as much >> monetary >> >> > >>> losses as the >> >> > >>> > > > >> > "elites"- it's all relative, depending on the number >> of >> >> zeros. >> >> > >> >> > >>> > > > >> > On Oct 24, 1:37 am, archytas <[email protected]> >> wrote: >> >> > >> >> > >>> > > > >> > > There was philosophy once called logical positivism. >> >> > >>> \\it's people >> >> > >>> > > > >> > > were well-intentioned, like Russell and Carnap. If >> you >> >> > >>> have a few >> >> > >>> > > > >> > > hours to spare I could explain its basics - in the >> end >> >> it >> >> > >>> got so >> >> > >>> > > > >> > > concerned with words they were all that was left. >> >> > >>> Strangely it was >> >> > >>> > > > >> > > accused of being crude in its use of brute fact. >> >> > >> >> > >>> > > > >> > > The problem as I see it is that we want democracy >> but >> >> have >> >> > >>> not >> >> > >>> > > > found a >> >> > >>> > > > >> > > way to accept its biggest flaw - that of decisions >> made >> >> > >>> through the >> >> > >>> > > > >> > > sway of ignorance, and further problems with the >> >> corruption >> >> > >>> of >> >> > >>> > > > >> > > representatives. Attempts at a fix of this in >> >> perfection >> >> > >>> are doomed >> >> > >>> > > > >> > > or the equivalent of fiddling while Rome burns. >> >> > >> >> > >>> > > > >> > > One might try to produce communication free of >> ideology >> >> and >> >> > >>> this let >> >> > >>> > > > >> > > Reason alone have power (Habermas) - but as far as I >> >> > >>> > > > >> > > can >> >> > >>> see this >> >> > >>> > > > >> > > never works - and Habermas only suggests his 'ideal >> >> speech >> >> > >>> > > > situation' >> >> > >>> > > > >> > > as an ideal type (following Weber). >> >> > >> >> > >>> > > > >> > > The best positive I can reach is that we could >> change >> >> our >> >> > >>> material >> >> > >>> > > > >> > > conditions to produce less discontent. To get to an >> >> > >>> understanding >> >> > >>> > > > of >> >> > >>> > > > >> > > this we need to agree on some basic facts - and the >> >> > >>> > > > >> > > move >> >> > >>> towards >> >> > >>> > > > these >> >> > >>> > > > >> > > is critical. People as old as Orn and myself can >> >> remember >> >> > >>> when it >> >> > >>> > > > was >> >> > >>> > > > >> > > possible for most in the West to get somewhere near >> >> > >>> > > > >> > > this >> >> > >>> because >> >> > >>> > > > there >> >> > >>> > > > >> > > were plenty of well paid jobs about. >> Oversimplifying a >> >> lot >> >> > >>> this is >> >> > >>> > > > >> > > not now the case and we need to establish what the >> new >> >> > >>> conditions >> >> > >>> > > > are. >> >> > >> >> > >>> > > > >> > > Productivity is vastly enhanced from the times in >> which >> >> our >> >> > >>> work >> >> > >>> > > > >> > > ethics arose. My guess is we could get by quite >> nicely >> >> on >> >> > >>> a 30hr >> >> > >>> > > > >> > > working week and a 40 week year with >> >> > >> >> > ... >> >> > >> >> > read more ยป >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > -- >> > ( >> > ) >> > |_D Allan >> > >> > Life is for moral, ethical and truthful living. >> > >> > > > > -- > ( > ) > |_D Allan > > Life is for moral, ethical and truthful living. > > >
