You are asking for a description of a mystical moment? Feeling and knowing (also beyond those) the very being of every aspect of creation, every person, planet, plant animal atom quantum; unity with all life and all lives lived in awareness in the moment. It can come in peaks and is hard but not impossible to sustain. The longer it is sustained, the more the ecstatic becomes the place of peace and eventually fear subsides with the integration of a non dual or unity viewpoint. It is not impossible, but may seem so to someone that has not experienced it or does not believe it can be sustained. Anone needing to quibble over the language of the experience isn't really interested in it.
Reading the biographies of Timothy Leary's group was interesting to me. Although I hated the fact that he dumped LSD into the mainstream and thousands of unstable personalities were never the same, I knew some of them. But the exploration of that group into altered states of consciousness led a generation of Americans who were willing to take the risk a glimpse into the mystic, even if it was substance induced. Not unlike shamanistic rituals all over the world, although those substances are generally local and natural. Aldous Huxley was, I think, the most articulate of the group to explain it (his Doors of Perception is a good start). He left the world after being administered a massive dose of LSD on his deathbed. Ram Das is still beating the religious drum. John Lilly was a wacko but his Mind of the Dolphin was OK. Stanislav Grof is still teaching holotropic breath work as a means of entry into the mystic naturally. Ultimately, the peak experiences are sustained and integrated into a life viewpoint, now referred to as non dual. there is a ton of reading to be had there if anyone is open to it. Bill Hicks the comedian preferred psilocybin after his mystical experiences and left the world laughing his ass off with it. On Wednesday, March 18, 2015 at 12:45:05 PM UTC-4, archytas wrote: > > Not my work Allan - comes from a study of 3000 reported mystic experiences > in a book called 'The Relevance of Bliss'. You can't really deny it by > coming up with another category. This amounts to saying all chemistry is > wrong because it doesn't contain my account of not liking salt. The > mystics tend to discount like this, in order to have their purified, > authentic form, like the 'precious' many kids have or as in Lord of the > Rings. > > When it comes to observation we don't even know what water is, unless > looking at a lake. > > > It has been suggested that H1.5O may better reflect the formula at very > small (attosecond) timescales when some of the H-atoms appear invisible to > neutron and electron interaction. The experimental results have since been > questioned and described as erroneous , but have been more recently > confirmed and thought due to a failure of the Born-Oppenheimer > approximation (this assumes that the electronic motion and the nuclear > motion in molecules can be separated) Thus the formula H1.5O is incorrect > but such suggestions do, however, add support to the view that observations > concerning the structure of water should be tempered by the timescale used. > The stuff is always moving and highly promiscuous. > > We rarely know the nature of things, if at all. RP is assuming > unconscious unity, but as we can hardly report back from this achievement, > it is posited and we might posit a more dappled condition-reality than the > one. > > There's a guy in Finland with Molly's imagination, turned to a biocentric > dark matter and energy field view which implies dark protons running in our > 'blood' or magnetic selves. He's a serious physicist admitting he is > speculating. .Nice bloke, lovely kids. No use thinking this stuff while > wiring a circuit and he knows. > > Should I assume, from the lack of description of actual mystic moments > (Tony apart) that people in here don't have them but rather like claiming > to have had and believe in them? I've done some interviews in which people > very kindly went on at length and were hospitable to questioning in a > feedback loop. I must get out more. The local Methodist minister does > some very African stuff. I promised to fix his floorboards after the last > event got a bit hectic. Will go and do this now. That session made me > cringe - but I have a lot of shots of non-verbal language and what I think > of as out of body reasoning. Morality seems to be a lot about that, > including coercive moralising. > > > > On Wednesday, March 18, 2015 at 6:43:58 AM UTC, Allan Heretic wrote: >> >> You for got one.. none of the above. Or find something you were not >> looking for. Or as a Buddhist might put it like walking through the gate >> less gate not knowing it is there. >> >> تجنب. القتل والاغتصاب واستعباد الآخرين >> Avoid; murder, rape and enslavement of others >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: archytas <[email protected]> >> To: [email protected] >> Sent: Wed, 18 Mar 2015 7:25 AM >> Subject: Re: Mind's Eye Einstein and the Mystics >> >> These were the categories out of 1000 people who had had mystic >> experiences naming the 'cause'. >> >> Depression, despair 183.7 >> Prayer, meditation 135.7 >> Natural beauty 122.7 >> Participation in religious worship 111.7 >> Literature, drama, film 82.0 >> Illness 80.0 >> Music 56.7 >> Crises in personal relations 37.3 >> The death of others 28.0 >> Sacred places 26.0 >> Visual arts 24.7 >> Creative work 20.7 >> The prospect of death 15.3 >> Silence, solitude 15.3 >> Anaesthetic drugs 10.7 >> Physical activity 09.7 >> Relaxation 09.7 >> Childbirth 08.7 >> Happiness 07.3 >> Psychedelic drugs 06.7 >> Sexual relations 04.0 >> >> >> >> >> On Wednesday, March 18, 2015 at 6:15:01 AM UTC, archytas wrote: >>> >>> Certainly logic in that RP. Physics has got very interested >>> (speculatively) on observer-observed 'interactions' and quantum-jumping in >>> 4 sheets of space-time shadows of 8 dimensions and a role for dark matter >>> in biology. You have to be pretty clever to follow it and pretty dumb to >>> think you understand it, and that understanding requires some sort of >>> notion of ourselves as electro-magnetic fields in instantaneous connection >>> with distant aliens (these claims on a non-scientific basis are found in >>> some 'primitive dreamtimes') - as well as more material-organic. Someone >>> was standing next to me when I saw my Mongol horde and she didn't see it. >>> My mind distinctly placed the scene as 'outside me' yet clearly it was >>> inside my virtual space. >>> >>> There has long been talk of misplaced concreteness and the bifurcation >>> of reality (AN Whitehead here, deep in Eastern history). Reality is >>> structured and so is the concept of duality. Rapture and bliss may be good >>> for us like breast-feeding, but seem unlikely as much other than a >>> variation in human experience. However, I do think some kind of first >>> contact might be made, even in trying to have such experience. >>> >>> On Wednesday, March 18, 2015 at 3:48:25 AM UTC, RP Singh wrote: >>>> >>>> The state of bliss or rapture is just a state of awareness of a human >>>> being, it cannot be called non-dual or God-state. If you look at the very >>>> word 'non-dual' it means absence of two and in effect one. In any state of >>>> consciousness or awareness there are always two--the observer and the >>>> observation, there is the one that is aware and the bliss or rapture. >>>> Non-dual expresses a singularity, the 'ONE', where there is no other, in >>>> effect a state beyond consciousness or maybe just a permanent state of >>>> unconsciousness. It is not death but the supreme state from which the >>>> entire creation streams out following the big bang or whatever. >>>> >>>> On Wed, Mar 18, 2015 at 4:17 AM, archytas <[email protected]> wrote: >>>> >>>>> Indeed you are a god to me Tony - just don't fall on my spot at the >>>>> bottom of the precipice or break Allan's coffee machine on the way down. >>>>> One could fall to grace. The Russians stopped drilling into the Earth's >>>>> core at about 8 miles. Some believe this was because they could hear the >>>>> screams from Hell. In fact, their drill just hit a pot of Allan's double >>>>> espresso and Gabby was scalded on the floor below. We have had to keep >>>>> the >>>>> trap-door shut since then, though we now get messages she has made her >>>>> own >>>>> hope and sunshine, >>>>> >>>>> If the mystics are mystic, why do they keep copying each other like >>>>> management textbook writers and gurus? I sort of want something >>>>> different >>>>> and if I had the experience would be really pissed off if I could only >>>>> describe it as though I'd just come out of a Tom Perter's session. Of >>>>> course, I haven't be purified yet or got a licence to fly the higher >>>>> plane. If it's VTOL I promise to drop by and take you on the ride. >>>>> >>>>> There has to be more to mysticism than the Soylent Green type and the >>>>> sales pitchers of its nutritional value. Maths with no numbers does a >>>>> bit >>>>> of it for me, but as we know, Allan zeroes out. We use light to remind >>>>> mice about good times and they return to them. Thought a lot on Andrew's >>>>> framework down by the river. A couple of young girls were hugging Zak - >>>>> his now rather done in back legs got a temporary cure and he bounded with >>>>> the mystic eyes of pleasure for a bit. Max went to round the old guy up >>>>> so >>>>> we could go home, but the girls' dad was telling them about river otters, >>>>> so we stayed a while. To the girls' delight, the dogs went into the >>>>> river >>>>> to demonstrate. It's out there somewhere. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On Tuesday, March 17, 2015 at 9:35:33 PM UTC, facilitator wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>> I happen to be very humble. Sometimes proud of it. I did not >>>>>> answer myself. Anyone reading that has to resharpen their senses so as >>>>>> to >>>>>> make a more simple response quite profound. >>>>>> >>>>>> Clearly their is something at work here which requires me know to >>>>>> "adjust" my dispenser orifice. My narcissistic arrogance was not >>>>>> present >>>>>> at that age since I mostly found myself fighting off gangs from other >>>>>> blocks in my urban neighborhood. Very little time to think past which >>>>>> alley way is the quickest route home. Being careful not to become >>>>>> cynical, >>>>>> I weave my way around and find no alley way. Expounding on this any >>>>>> further >>>>>> would probably cheapen the experience. Fascinating! Thinking there >>>>>> might >>>>>> be a deity involved would be a first step, thinking I might be my own >>>>>> deity >>>>>> is not a step but a precipice. >>>>>> >>>>>> On Tuesday, March 17, 2015 at 5:13:36 PM UTC-4, archytas wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Knowing more than Tony is easy. Like Zaphod Beeblebrox, his ego is >>>>>>> bigger than imagination from a slice of Proust's angel cake that took >>>>>>> him >>>>>>> back to an aunty's. Using such power to visit an aunt reveals a lack >>>>>>> of >>>>>>> knowledge or a very dull boy. As Tony cannot be the latter, one >>>>>>> presumes >>>>>>> the former, though this does not exclude the possibility his ego is >>>>>>> bigger >>>>>>> than the universe itself. >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> -- >>>>> >>>>> --- >>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>> Groups ""Minds Eye"" group. >>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send >>>>> an email to [email protected]. >>>>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >>>>> >>>> >>>> -- >> >> --- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> ""Minds Eye"" group. >> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an >> email to [email protected]. >> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >> > -- --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups ""Minds Eye"" group. 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