At 01:09 PM 10/7/2007, you wrote:
>Hi Marsha --
>
> > What is your definition of nihilism? I'm rather tired of you using
> > the word for its psychological and emotional effect. What is your
> > definition of nihilism? It seems to me it represents the limitation
> > of human knowledge. Why should that be considered so devastating?
>
>I don't define nihilism in any special way, nor do I use the word for
>"psychological or emotional effect", although it seems to have affected you.
>Nihilism doesn't relate to the "limitation of knowledge", unless empirical
>knowledge is fundamental to your philosophy. Pirsig's MoQ certainly doesn't
>hold that position, and I have always maintained that empiricism (i.e.,
>logical positivism) is limited to experiential knowledge.
>
>"Mereological" (compositional) nihilism is an obscure term that applies to
>most ontologies that are based on a primary reality, such as Quality or
>Essence. The general Nihilism reference in Wikipedia provides a very clear
>definition:
>
>"Nihilism (from the Latin nihil, nothing) is a philosophical position which
>argues that the world, especially past and current human existence, is
>without objective meaning, purpose, comprehensible truth, or essential
>value."
The rest of that paragraph:
"Nihilists generally assert some or all of the following: there is no
reasonable proof of the existence of a higher ruler or creator, a
"true morality" does not exist, and secular ethics are impossible;
therefore, life has no truth, and no action can be preferable to any
other. The term nihilism is sometimes used synonymously with anomie
to denote a general mood of despair at the pointlessness of existence.[1]
Nihilism is often more of a charge leveled against a particular idea,
movement, or group, than it is an actual philosophical position to
which one overtly subscribes. Movements such as Dada, Futurism,[2]
and deconstructionism,[3] among others, have been identified by
commentators as "nihilistic" at various times in various contexts."
Further, and more to the point:
"Often this means or is meant to imply that the beliefs of the
accuser are more substantial or truthful, whereas the beliefs of the
accused are nihilistic, and thereby comparatively amount to nothing
(or are simply claimed to be destructively amoralistic)."
>This article also notes that Heidegger had a "special meaning" for nihilism,
>which was philosophy's failure to acknowledge "being" as the fundamental
>reality. The existentialists took this to mean that being precedes essence,
>and Sartre based his "Being and Nothingness" on this premise. To me this is
>nihilism, for if essence evolves from being it has no more value than being
>itself, which is to call existence the primary reality. I reject this view,
>as I believe Pirsig does also, although making a metaphysics of Quality
>leaves being and existence in an ontological limbo, along with meaning and
>purpose.
>
>By equating Quality to Value, which is a semantic (non-metaphysical)
>equivalent, and attributing morality to the physical world (rather than to
>subjective sensibility), Pirsig has conveniently dismissed the meaning and
>purpose of life. In addition, his aversion to spirituality and rejection of
>a transcendent reality seems to be telling us that "human existence is
>without objective meaning, purpose, comprehensible truth, or essential
>value." I'll let you decide to what extent my offensive term is applicable.
Under the heading 'In ethics and morality':
"In the domain of ethics, nihilist or nihilistic is often used as a
derogatory term referring to a complete rejection of all systems of
authority, morality, and social custom, or one who purportedly makes
such a rejection. Either through the rejection of previously accepted
bases of belief or through extreme relativism or skepticism, the
nihilist is construed as one who believes that none of these claims
to power are valid. Nihilism not only dismisses received moral
values, but rejects 'morality' outright, viewing it as baseless."
RMP does not reject 'morality' outright, quite the contrary, as you
well know.
Marsha
Moq_Discuss mailing list
Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc.
http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org
Archives:
http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/
http://moq.org.uk/pipermail/moq_discuss_archive/
