[Marsha to Ham] It rather amuses me that when you get into a corner, you drag out the word nihilism. Can you not deal with the concept 'unknown'?
[Arlo] Mitt Romney: "Freedom requires religion". It's the biggest myth of the day. And one prime on the neocon agenda. You ask why Ham resorts to the tired "nihilism"-bugaboo, and I recall these words from "The Power of Nightmare". "[Strauss believed] Western liberalism led to nihilism, and had undergone a development at the end of which it could no longer define itself or defend itself. A development which took everything praiseworthy and admirable out of human beings, and made us into dwarf animals. Made us into herd animals—sick little dwarves, satisfied with a dangerous life in which nothing is true and everything is permitted. Strauss believed that the liberal idea of individual freedom led people to question everything—all values, all moral truths. Instead, people were led by their own selfish desires. And this threatened to tear apart the shared values which held society together. But there was a way to stop this, Strauss believed. It was for politicians to assert powerful and inspiring myths that everyone could believe in. They might not be true, but they were necessary illusions. One of these was religion; the other was the myth of the nation." And whether you hear this echoed in the pandering-but-moronic statements of a presidential candidate, or in the "barbarians at the gate" rhetoric of those who feel man needs some "intelligent designer" lest he be amoral and beastly, its the same core principle. It has its foundations in the "guilty at birth" rhetoric of the "Judeo-Christian" code, that has us all born evil and sinful, and in need of the power of some outside agent to cleanse us and make us Good. And in the sophmoric "analysis" of Bill O'Reily whose "culture war" consists of noble and good "religious traditionalists" battling immoral and evil "secular progressives", the same sad rhetoric is doled out for hours a day. The only "culture" brought historically by "religious traditionalists" is the oppressive and enslaving bounds of theocracy. Want to know what life under "religious traditionalist" rule would be like, witness our own European history prior to the Enlightenment. Sadly, were there more "secular progressives" in the middle eastern nations perhaps they impetus towards democracy would be greater. But telling people they are evil beasts who need to be saved by The Creator in order to be moral and righteous serves the power desires of our modern day leaders, and it (as Strauss saw) gives people the go-ahead to feel smug and superior while they behave like sheep. The irony, of course, is that O'Reily's "culture war" is the terra firma of the justification among "Islamofascists" to denounce Western life. Honestly, if you had to pick a side in the "culture war" that the "Islamofascists" would back, do you think it would be the "secular progressives"? Hell no. Here is another snippet from the Power of Nightmare. "But Qutb saw something else: the dancers in front of him were tragic lost souls. They believed that they were free. But in reality, they were trapped by their own selfish and greedy desires. American society was not going forwards; it was taking people backwards. They were becoming isolated beings, driven by primitive animal forces. Such creatures, Qutb believed, could corrode the very bonds that held society together. And he became determined that night to prevent this culture of selfish individualism taking over his own country." Ask youself, who does that sound like? Who among us decries a culture pushing us to be "primitive animals"? And who offers the solution of providing a "religious traditionalist" government/culture that "would provide a moral framework that would stop people’s selfish desires from overwhelming them."? (The quote, btw, is how Qutb described the Islamic-led government). "People need 'powerful myths', primarily 'god' and 'the nation'". Seems Sayyed Qutb would be very happy to hear someone in the "secularly degenerate" West say "freedom requires religion", and join forces in the "culture war" that pits the vile, corrupt "nihilists" against the Ardent Light of the Religious Traditionalist. ============= As a postscript here, I find it funny that we suddenly have a flock of candidates (both sides) who are tripping over themselves arguing about who is the biggest Christian. Reminds me of the Four Yorkshiremen skit of Monty Python (with apologies)... "Why I remember all the days I worshipped God in our church." "Church? Why we used to worship God in our living room, and serve him tea and crumpets!" "Crumpets?! Why God used to come over to our house, sit down, put his feet by the fire, and we'd serve him the finest meals while we ate cardboard." "Feed him? Why I remember fondly the nights God would come over and sleep in our beds." "Sleep? We used to let God have his way with us." "Oh sure, that's great if you think passive worship is best. We, on the other hand, would service god rather than be serviced, if you catch my drift." "Once a night?" "Aye." "Ha! We used to service God three times a day and then beat ourselves with hair whips to pass the hours until we could service him again." "Just three? Five times a day we'd whack off the almighty, while a flock of demons shredded our backs with sandpaper. Afterwards he'd kill us, just for fun, and the resurrect us in time to service him again." "I would have loved to have just been killed in between. Six times a day we'd give the almighty a hot oil rubdown, with release, and in between he'd toss our souls into a pool of molten lead and laugh as we melted into the fire." "Right. After performing oral sex on the lord, every hour on the hour, I'd praise his divine being while he tossed my sinful soul into a pit filled with fire and starving rats. Then, he'd resurrect me as various farm animals and it would start all over." "Ah, but we love the lord." "Try telling that to nihilists today... they won't believe you!" "They won't!" Moq_Discuss mailing list Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org Archives: http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ http://moq.org.uk/pipermail/moq_discuss_archive/
