Hi Platt: Steve: >> Your example of "the idea >> that religion can tell us something about about reality and >> morality that >> reason can't" is an intellectual justification of a social >> pattern rather >> than a social pattern itself. > Platt: > You may be right, but I got the idea for "static social ideas" from > Pirsig's explication of Victorian ideas about morality which he > invariably > described as "static patterns." Also the following quote suggests the > existence of "static social ideas:" > > "It has caused him to filter out what we call normal cultural > intellectual > patterns just as ruthlessly as our culture filters out his." (Lila, > 26) > > It was "normal cultural intellectual patterns" I had in mind in citing > "static social ideas." For example, the dominance of science as the > arbiter > of truth in Western society I would describe as a "normal cultural > intellectual pattern," i.e., a "static social idea." > > Maybe to keep the levels pure it would be better if I referred to such > examples as science as "intellectual ideas that dominant society" > rather > than trying to squeeze intellect into becoming part of the social > level. > Where to draw the lines between levels is, as you know, a source of > continuing debate.
Steve: I do think that much clarity in the MOQ is gained when we use the term "intellectual pattern" as interchangeable with "pattern of thought." Some people find the "simply thinking" definition to be confusing because they extend thinking to mean any choice-making rather than a rationale for a choice. Pirsig's clarifying note in LC that I quoted referring to intellectual justifications of social patterns being intellectual patterns seems very clear. Justifications or rationales are always intellectual patterns regardless of what they are trying to justify. Regards, Steve Moq_Discuss mailing list Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org Archives: http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ http://moq.org.uk/pipermail/moq_discuss_archive/
