Magnus: After reading, and being engaged in, a couple of head-on discussions here, I'm beginning to wonder if we have any common ground to stand on. One such common ground should be (IMO) the notion of what a metaphysics is. If we don't share that, we will end up like the people with no sense of direction running 100 yards on Monty Python's silly Olympics. Everyone will end up at their own 100 yard line and yell "I won!".
Ron: I see MoQ as being a radical metaphysics as it pertains to immediate experience of the individual, in some ways MoQ is that silly Olympics. But think its Platt that's yelling "I won" I can't speak for the rest But I'm not big on Metaphysical finish lines. Content to mangle about Obstacle course like the fool I am. Magnus: However, IMO there's one crucial difference between the two: If one of your friends gets one of those nifty things called mobile phone, your metadata is insufficient to describe this friend. You have to add a "Mobile phone" to your metadata. This is ok for metadata. But, IMO, it's *not* ok to do that for a metaphysics. Of course we can do that with our understanding/model of the metaphysics, but not to the metaphysics itself. The metaphysics has been working for ~15 billion years according to current research, and since time is a physical concept, the metaphysics has been ruling time as well, perhaps even initiating it from a timeless soup some "time" before the big bang. So, to me, a metaphysics is really outside our reality. We can't see it, we can't change it, we can only see it working in our reality. The only thing we can do is to describe it as good as we can and in doing so, understand the reality better. Anyone else? Ron: This is not a criticism, but from what you wrote, it seems to me You are looking at metaphysics/physics from a SOM perspective. Which is o.k. As long as you are aware of it. Metaphysics is a body of thoughts about the nature of ultimate reality that is induced or projected from human experience. If I take you to mean that ultimate reality is outside the human senses or the capacity to understand or comprehend it I agree. But I do think we can change it from our ability to project Possibilities and select likely probabilities and plan based on experience. Of course how well we plan is based on the accuracy of the descriptions, In MoQ we are beings of value in a universe of value, we are it, so of course we can change it, we can change it simply by viewing it differently. Moq_Discuss mailing list Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org Archives: http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ http://moq.org.uk/pipermail/moq_discuss_archive/ Moq_Discuss mailing list Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org Archives: http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ http://moq.org.uk/pipermail/moq_discuss_archive/
