[Platt] "Bet'cha can't?" How childish can you get? [Arlo] You still have not made the case that I disagree with any quotes you've provided. You on other hand ignore 50% of Pirsig easily, as I've shown clearly. So your little "Pee Wee" of accusing me of that which I've shown you to be guilty of is what's "childish".
So, here you go, take the premise, the 'self' is the contact point between the assimilated collective consciousness and the bounded proprietary experience of the organism, and give me a quote from Pirsig you think "disproves" this. Every quote offered so far, both me and by you, supports my position. Can you say the same? How does ""Mental patterns do not originate out of inorganic nature. They originate out of society" support your claim? [Platt] Yes, it's all about context -- half of which you choose to ignore. [Arlo] Prove this. I've already demonstrated clearly it is the case with you. [Platt] I have never claimed culture has no influence. But as for "collectivist origin," only a Marxist would try to float that balloon. [Arlo] "Mental patterns do not originate out of inorganic nature. They originate out of society." (LILA) Actually, to the best of my knowledge Marx never wrote about the origins of mind. Maybe you have him confused with Vygotsky. But however you wish to frame it, yes, Marx and Pirsig both float this balloon, and I agree with them. [Platt] I have agreed time and again with the influence of culture on the individual. [Arlo] "The seventeenth century French culture exists, therefore I think... " "The seventeenth century French culture exists ... therefore I am." "Mental patterns do not originate out of inorganic nature. They originate out of society". Yes or no, do you agree or disagree with these statements. Flat out answer please. Not that society "influences" the individual, but that "mental patterns ORIGINATE out of society." Yes or no? [Platt] What you refuse to recognize is the ability of the individual to see beyond the view provided by cultural spectacles and respond to DQ, moving evolution forward. [Arlo] Again, the premise of the self as contact point between the assimilated social consciousness and the bounded proprietary experience of the organism absolutely recognizes this. But the premise also recongizes Pirsig's understanding that "Mental patterns do not originate out of inorganic nature. They originate out of society" (LILA) So again, this premise is based on a full context reading of the MOQ, not like yours which uses Pirsig to disprove Pirsig. Moq_Discuss mailing list Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org Archives: http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ http://moq.org.uk/pipermail/moq_discuss_archive/
