Hi Bo
First off you asked:
"Show me one pattern you deem intellectual that's not a S/O derivative."
According to Pirsig:
Annotation129 (Lila's Child):
"I’ve always thought this is incorrect because many forms of intellect
do not have a subject-object construction. These include logic itself,
mathematics, computer programming languages, and, I believe some
primitive languages (although I can’t remember what they are)."
To the above I would probably add Fuzzy Systems, Chaos and Quantum Theory.
Secondly, you said:
"SOM is no metaphysical system after being subsumed by the MOQ. "
As far as I'm aware, even if the MOQ does subsume SOM (it doesn't - it's
a competing Intellectual pattern of Value and the MOQ is in opposition
to it) this doesn't alter SOM's existence as a metaphysical system.
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Hi Horse
On 2 Nov.u wrote:
Hi Platt, Bo and others
So can you give me an instance of where Pirsig specifically equates
reason with SOM.
I doubt if the term (reason) is used other than in the said "reasoning"
context, not to speak of "....specifically equating reason with SOM",
but French has its "Raison" and German its "Vernunft" that has a more
objective ring to it than merely drawing conclusions. And that
SOM=objectivity you can hardly deny*).
Reason is referred to in several places in Lila and Lila's Child (not in
the sense of "reasoning but in the sense that I indicated earlier) but
it is not equated with SOM.
BTW. This exemplifies the point that keep surfacing again and again.
From the inside intellect reason is the ability to think, while the MOQ
sees reason as the ability to distinguish between what's TRUE
(objective) and what's superstition, faith, belief (subjective) ... and that
this is the highest static value!
Bo
Reason is part of the process of thinking not thinking itself.
The putting together of items of information in order to reach a
supportable conclusion. In the MOQ this would be Good and not truth -
i.e. the best explanation given the data.
PS
*) the "SOM=Objectivity" assertion sounds a bit strange these days,
after all the idealists claim that (objective seen) everything is subjective
(mind). But this is the development that Pirsig describes in ZAMM
having cone through so many convolutions that we have lost track of
the original quality, namely TRUTH as independent of opinion
emerged out of a past that did not have an inkling of this constellation.
Cheers Bo
Horse
--
Life should NOT be a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in an
attractive and well preserved body, but to skid in sideways, chocolate in one hand, wine
in the other, body thoroughly used up, totally worn out and screaming "WOO HOO what
a ride!"... Hunter S Thompson
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