RMP: "I think it's better to say that time is a static intellectual concept that is one of the very first to emerge from Dynamic Quality. That keeps Dynamic Quality concept-free..."
"The MOQ starts with the source of undifferentiated perception itself as the ultimate reality. The very first differentiation is probably `change`. The second one may be `before and after`. From this sense of `before and after` emerge more complex concepts of time."[32] (The Role of Evolution, Time and Order in Pirsig's "Metaphysics of Quality) -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Ham Priday Sent: Monday, August 24, 2009 6:24 PM To: [email protected] Subject: Re: [MD] The percolating SOL David -- > Ham said: > There remains, however, the question: What IS the cause of Value? > > dmb says: > When someone answers that, I'll ask about the cause of > the cause of value. Then somebody can ask about the > cause of the cause of the cause of value. And so on, forever. > Just as in the case of theology's "prime mover" or "first cause", > it's a goofy, goofy fake problem. It is a "goofy fake problem" only for those who cannot see their way out of the fallacy of infinite regression. Since they have no answer to "What caused the Big Bang?" or "What created Consciousness?", they refuse to regard the concept of a primary cause as valid. And so it remains a metaphysical problem. Empirical reality is understood as a cause-and-effect system, the "effects" seen as a series of events occurring in time. This presumes that dimensions like time and space are fundamental to reality, rather than the relational mode of finite experience. Yet experience has to be the impediment in our understanding, as logic does not support the view that the first instance of anything is "uncaused". It is man's intellectual bias, not logic, which rejects the idea of a "first cause" because it's associated with theology. When we free ourselves from religious bias and adversity to metaphysics, it becomes clear that everything in existence is a "creation", and that phenomena which have no causal explanation can only be accounted for by an "uncreated source" that is not limited by existential conditions such as time, space, and evolution. Regrettably, despite all their talk about the short-sightedness of SOM thinking, MoQ's author and his followers are unwilling to seek understanding beyond finitude. Essentially speaking, Ham Moq_Discuss mailing list Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org Archives: http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ http://moq.org.uk/pipermail/moq_discuss_archive/ Moq_Discuss mailing list Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org Archives: http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ http://moq.org.uk/pipermail/moq_discuss_archive/
