DmB said:
The short answer is basically just that Rorty is all about the linguistic whereas classical pragmatists are all about experience. This is not to deny that conversation counts as experience, of course, but experience is a much larger category that also includes, importantly, non-verbal experience. This is the big difference. For James, Dewey and Pirsig this non-verbal category is quite central to the whole project. In Pirsig's case, for example, the non-verbal is Dynamic Quality. If you take that out of the MOQ, you get the metaphysics of nothing. Ron replies: Experience, whether verbal or non-verbal is predicated on meaning. The main point Aristotle makes. Meaning is largely culturally defined. Thus he maintained how we understand experience is largely culturally defined. Experience, for Aristotle was based on limit through limit unity through unity understanding, so the understanding of experience is through complex relations of very broad generalizations of meaning. I think thats the best any Pragmatist can say about it. I'm not sure I agree with your assertion that Dynamic Quality is non verbal, it's too broad a generalization that supports a correspondance viewpoint. Dynamic Quality as I understand the term, means the plural, the unrecognizable, the defiance of understanding, the unlimited, flux, ect... The Greeks had it together, Elenchus demonstrated how language is reduced to such broad generalizations of meaning in experience. Pirsig, in my opinion improves apon the whole Pragmatic enterprise with the division of the good into four types. These four types of Pragmatic truths often conflict, but when they support eachother in conflict or in harmony, we call it "true" in the general meaning of the term. To me "Pragmatic truth" is to understand what we mean when we term something as good or true and how we arrive at those meanings. To recap, I feel to condemn the "we're suspended in language" as mere words divorced of experiential meaning is overlooking how natural languages form the understanding of immediate experiences, that even the most raw response of stimuli is an understanding of experience based in memory of one sort or another. value requires it. -Ron _________________________________________________________________ Hotmail: Trusted email with Microsoft’s powerful SPAM protection. http://clk.atdmt.com/GBL/go/201469226/direct/01/ Moq_Discuss mailing list Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org Archives: http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ http://moq.org.uk/pipermail/moq_discuss_archive/ Moq_Discuss mailing list Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org Archives: http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ http://moq.org.uk/pipermail/moq_discuss_archive/ Moq_Discuss mailing list Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org Archives: http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ http://moq.org.uk/pipermail/moq_discuss_archive/
